The title says it all. I signed up for the card in April. Threw down the $95 annual fee like it was nothing. Let my mom buy the groceries with it for a few weeks so I could hit the $3,000 necessary to achieve the 120,000 bonus points.

And I just flexed on her. Not on my mom on my girlfriend. Dropped 20,000 points for a night at the local Holiday Inn Express, complete with a continental breakfast.

But she just doesn't seem impressed. We walk in the front door and approach the concierge, where I slide my license that expired two weeks ago across the counter, followed by the silver, spinning IHG MasterCard that reflects every last drop of light in the room.

"Thank you for being an IHG Rewards Club member," she says, and she means it. She begins to check me into the room when I flash a wink at my girlfriend and drop the line: "I was wondering if it was possible to upgrade rooms, since I'm a, you know, Platinum Elite Status. It is--one of the perks."

She flashes me another one of those smiles out of a Philip Marlowe story and swipes another card. "I can upgrade you to the suite."

I nod. "There you go," she says, "a suite. Room 212." I don't say thank you because I don't have to. I'm Platinum Elite Status.

The suite doesn't have a jacuzzi like I had hoped, but it does have a couch which I'm sure I'll be fucking on later thanks to my IHG card.

We go out for drinks with her friends. I open up a tab for everyone under my card, letting them know it's 4 points per dollar on everything for the first year, so load it up.

She gets hammered. Starts screaming Alanis Morissette at the karaoke bar. And finally we head back to the suite where she eats her double XL chalupa, throws up in the trash can, and falls asleep. Meanwhile I'm laying next to her like an asshole, listening to her snore, trying to decide whether or not it's creepy to touch her ass, and staring at the couch that held every possibility in the universe only hours before.

I just don't know what to do. What's the point in being an IHG Rewards member if the points and the Platinum Elite status don't turn her on?

Fellow butter churners, I did it.

I started this hobby with a simple goal: save $600 on a flight to Europe.

11 years later, I have:

- 37 open credit cards

- 14 checking accounts

- 6 savings accounts

- 3 business checking accounts for businesses whose primary business activity is applying for business credit cards

- 2.8 million points spread across 19 currencies

- $11,400 in annual fees

- $73,000 of available credit at banks that absolutely despise me

- a spreadsheet with 41 tabs

- a P2 who no longer asks why another Chase envelope arrived

- three Hyatt free night certificates that expire Thursday

- $26.14 in United TravelBank that I will defend with my life

- $200 at Saks Fifth Avenue worth of objects I never wanted

- enough CLEAR credits to identify every member of my extended family biometrically

- a monthly Uber Eats order placed exclusively because “the credit expires tonight”

- six Priority Pass cards and no idea which one I'm supposed to use

- a drawer containing 31 physical credit cards organized by issuer, category multiplier, statement date, and emotional significance

Yesterday I spent 47 minutes determining whether a $6.83 purchase at Dollar General would code as grocery.

It did.

I earned 27 points.

At my current valuation of 1.7 cpp, my research generated approximately $0.46 in value, or $0.59/hour before taxes.

This morning my wife asked if we could just buy plane tickets to Hawaii.

I explained that this would be financially irresponsible because there is saver availability from Omaha to Honolulu on February 11, 2027 with a 19-hour layover in Denver if we reposition the night before.

She said she has work.

I told her that's the kind of scarcity mindset that keeps people poor.

Anyway, I just paid my $695 annual fee.

See you guys in the What Card Wednesday thread. I'm thinking about opening another Amex Platinum.

You wanted it, so here it is.. TL;DR! It's not this simple, but if I HAD to condense it... I'd say...cash customers generally subsidize the rewards on credit cards through paying the same, higher price at the store but not getting rewards. To a lesser extent, this happens with debit cards and low reward credit cards too. Banks use these credit card fees (and the extra, premium fee they charge when people use reward cards) to fund at least a chunk of the rewards program (there is spirited disagreement in the comments section on how much comes from this vs. interest).

Further Reading As a result of the popularity of this post, I was invited to develop this content into a series of articles over at loopholetravel.com! I'll be cleaning up this post, rolling it out in a three part series, and digging deeper into other "behind the scenes" aspects of churning/rewards cards in future articles. The first article, an adaptation of the beginning of this post, can be read here: https://loopholetravel.com/2017/01/25/looking-loophole-really-pays-rewards-part/

Big thanks to everyone who contributed in the comments, gave this post the upvotes, and showed an interest in this information/my post!

Introduction As this post now has the honor of being included on the sidebar, I've gone back through and done some light editing. No content has been changed--I've just fixed some grammar, tweaked formatting, and changed some section headers.

The Post

I’ve been trying to think of a good way to contribute to this community lately. Unfortunately, I find myself struggling to come up with any original, informative information about churning that the veterans here haven’t already covered!

But, if you’re like me, you may wonder why this all works. Not just “because the offer says ‘XYZ’ so I can do ‘ABC’ and end up ahead.” Rather, how has an economic model evolved to the point where churners can get such valuable rewards from credit cards?

Well, I may not be a churning veteran like many of you, but I do have an undergraduate and graduate degree in business. And, I do work closely with the credit card processing division of a large retail company. I’m very familiar with what these credit card fees look like from the merchant’s perspective, and how the merchant passes that cost onto consumers.

I’ll use my IHG Rewards Mastercard as an example.

How do the fees work?

The flow of the transactions is:

Customer (me) -> Merchant (my grocery store) -> Processor (companies you’ve never heard of) -> Card Association (MasterCard) -> Issuing Bank (Chase)

I buy some bananas at a local grocery store with my IHG Rewards card. In essence, the grocery store is paying two separate fees: a processing fee and an interchange fee.

The processing fee is negotiable; this is how the processor makes their money. Large merchants have bargaining power and put pressure on their processors to lower the fee per transaction. This fee compensates the processor for building out the technical capabilities to “process” the transaction. These fees are usually a small part of the overall fee

The interchange fee is not negotiable. These fees make up the bulk of the overall fee paid by the merchant. MasterCard sets this fee, based on the merchant’s industry and customer’s card type. The fee is usually remitted by the merchant to the processor, and the processor passes the whole thing onto MasterCard. Then, MasterCard passes (most of) this fee to Chase (the issuing bank).

But, how does MasterCard decide the interchange fees? Well, they have a handy dandy 9 page set of charts that explains their fees. (Link to the PDF on this page: https://www.mastercard.us/en-us/about-mastercard/what-we-do/interchange.html). They vary both by industry (fast food vs. gas station, etc.) and card type (5 categories for MasterCard).

So, what are the five different interchange card categories for MasterCard? Going with my local grocery store example, these are MasterCard’s 2016-2017 interchange fees (by card category) for the “Base Supermarket” industry.

• Core Value: 1.48% + $0.10 per transaction

• Enhanced Value: 1.48% + $0.10 per transaction

• World: 1.58% + $0.10 per transaction

• World High Value: 1.90% + $0.10 per transaction

• World Elite:1.90% + $0.10 per transaction

My IHG Rewards MasterCard would probably fall in the “World,” “World High Value,” or “World Elite” categories. A plain, no rewards Bank Americard would probably fall in the “Core Value” or “Enhanced Value” categories. So, my grocery store keeps more money when someone pays with a Bank Americard than when I pay with my IHG Rewards Card. They keep even more money when someone uses debit. They keep even MORE money when someone uses debit, and actually runs it through as debit (enters a PIN #). And even MORE money when someone pays cash.

In fact, MasterCard’s debit fee for this category is 1.05% + $0.15 per transaction. Certain PIN debit transactions have a fee as low as 0.05% + $0.21.

What does the interchange fee cover?

Lots of things. The issuing bank has the risk of not collecting the balance on the credit card. They also are floating all the money used to finance the purchase. But, as you can see from the rates in the section above, rewards play a big part in that expense, so much so that different interchange fee categories have been created to separate the cost of the rewards on the cards.

How do the merchants react?

Now, as a merchant, am I going to try to charge everyone a different price? No. Why? Besides the fact that it is too complicated for most merchants to pull off, MasterCard explicitly forbids it. If you want to accept MasterCard, you have to accept them all at the same price (credit or debit). So, as the merchant, what do I do? Maybe offer a “cash” discount...and, sure, I’ll try to encourage customers to enter a PIN when they use their debit card. But, for the most part, I’ll probably just spread the cost of high fee cards over all consumers by upping prices on everything.

If you try to become the grocery store that doesn’t take MasterCard, you won’t be in business for long. Note that some businesses still don’t accept Discover, so Discover has significantly less bargaining power to push fees on merchants. Have you noticed Discover cards typically don’t have the premium rewards or co-branded cards that Visa and MasterCard do? I’ll let you connect the dots.

What’s the worst case scenario for the Issuer?

Us. Absolutely.

But, if you truly don’t carry a balance and incur interest charges, the issuing bank faces no losses from uncollectible accounts. Their costs are reduced to maintaining the website you log in to to view your balance, answering all your annoying secure messages and, oh yeah, the bonus.

If I met my entire $1,000 minimum spend on a “World High Value” MasterCard at my grocery store with 50 transactions, Chase would get somewhere in the neighborhood of $24 in interchange fees. Chase pays IHG much less than the “retail equivalent value” for the points they give me, as Chase is both buying them in bulk, and IHG is selling them at a discount, hoping to create brand loyalty by getting you plugged into their loyalty program.

But what about the bonus categories?

Well, the “World High Value” interchange fee for the “Airline” category, a popular bonus category, is 2.30% + $0.10 per transaction. That’s 0.40% higher than the comparable grocery store fee.

So who really pays for our rewards?

Do the merchant’s just “accept lower prices” because of the fees? No, not any more than they “accept lower prices” if the cost of anything else in their business goes up. Do the issuing banks “eat the expense” on the rewards? No, they pass it back through to the merchants with higher interchange fees. So who actually pays?

Cash, Debit, and low-reward Credit customers.

I’m going to lean heavily on an academic paper from the Boston branch of the Federal Reserve here because, well, they seem pretty smart.

Linked here: https://www.bostonfed.org/publications/public-policy-discussion-paper/2010/who-gains-and-who-loses-from-credit-card-payments-theory-and-calibrations.aspx

Here are some selected passages from the full-text of the paper:

• “...credit card companies impose a “no-surcharge rule” (NSR) that prohibits U.S. merchants from [from charging different prices for different cards], and most merchants are reluctant to give cash discounts. [So,] merchants mark up their retail prices for all consumers by enough to recoup the merchant fees from credit card sales.”

• “cash buyers must pay higher retail prices to cover merchants’ costs associated with the credit cards’ merchant fees. Because these fees are used to pay for rewards given to credit card users, and since cash users do not receive rewards, cash users also finance part of the rewards given to credit card users”

• “U.S. data show that credit card use is very positively correlated with consumer income. Consequently, the subsidy of credit card payers by cash payers also involves a regressive transfer of income from low-income to high income consumers”

• “On average, each cash buyer pays $149 to card users and each card buyer receives $1,133 from cash users every year, a total transfer of $1,282 from the average cash payer to the average card payer.”

• “when all households are divided into two income groups, each low-income household pays $8 to high-income households and each high-income household receives $430 from low-income households every year.”

• “on average, the lowest income household ($20, 000 or less annually) pays a transfer of $21 and the highest-income household ($150, 000 or more annually) receives a subsidy of $750 every year.”

• “Finally, about 79 percent of banks’ revenue from credit card merchant fees is obtained from cash payers, and disproportionately from low-income cash payers. “

At this point, I think it is important to point out that while this Federal Reserve paper seems like it is trying to make a judgement on whether this whole setup is right or wrong, I’m not trying to do that. I’m just trying to shed some light on the system that creates the possibility for these extremely high rewards.

In essence, rewards points are almost like the card companies reimbursing their most loyal customers for a large chunk of the fees they’re pushing to the merchants. The huge signup bonuses pale in comparison to the interchange fees they expect to earn over the life of the card. Potential interest income from carried balances may also be part of their calculation, but that is a much more risky enterprise for the issuing bank than just encouraging more transaction volume on their cards. There is a reason that it’s tough to get a card when your utilization it 99%--banks don’t want cardholders maxing their cards out. Pushing consumers further into debt by encouraging overspending puts the collection of the entire balance at risk. Over 1.5 million people file for bankruptcy annually in the US, and many more pay back lenders at a discount in debt consolidation and reduction arrangements. No banks want those kind of customers.

Finally, none of this directly addresses the question: why hasn’t the churning loophole been closed more aggressively? I imagine the issuing banks just don’t see it as big enough of a threat to go on a witch hunt and alienate some potentially legitimate customers, especially when they can just push the cost through to the merchant. As data analytics improve and the issuing bank’s systems follow suit, I suspect we’ll see a more targeted effort to weed out churners. But, remember, the value of the rewards to you is much greater the cost of those rewards to the issuing bank. How much money, time, and effort are these issuers really going to put into weeding out a small minority of customers that cost them, maybe, a couple thousand a year? Time will tell.

I hope this was informative! I tried to strike a balance between detail and readability. Please feel free to point out any oversights on my part, or confusing sections where I could improve the post!

Response to Comments

As this is coming up a lot in the comments, I wanted to clarify my thoughts on the interest income piece. When an issuer is looking to give out points, and their intention is to earn back the value of those points through interest, they would ask themselves "will giving rewards cause the average customer to carry a higher balance than the would without rewards, enough so that the incremental interest income offsets the cost of the points?" This may be the case, but I'm skeptical its the primary method by which they plan to recoup the cost, as its not directly tied to the rewards rate (like interchange fees are) and its much more risky than encouraging higher volume.

To further my theory on why interchange > interest income for recouping rewards points, why is Amex offering a generous signup bonus and ongoing rewards on these charge cards (Gold Card and Platinum Card), where the balance is due in full each month (no encouragement or ability to carry a balance and pay interest)?

https://card.americanexpress.com/prg/?s_clid=c98323c566c53953a32b094e62511555&gclid=CjwKEAiAwfzDBRCRmJe7z_7h8yQSJAC4corOliMXgXLjflVdOEQNIf21Ci4ZRRFtf8fqbDKDHAzAsBoC5sbw_wcB

Topics and Q&A, based on comments

So this has gotten a lot bigger than I had imagined! And, I've gotten a lot of constructive feedback in the process. I'm going to try to summarize the critiques below and address them. I'll try to make sure I say "I don't know," when I don't know, and "this is my opinion" when I'm just speculating. Again, I've only seen this from the merchant side, so I'm sure there are some knowledge gaps some of you can help fill!

The roll of risk management in approvals /u/Robert_tow makes an excellent point that approving a customer with a high FICO, regardless of their projected profitability, allows the bank to lend to an equally low FICO customer and keep their risk profile the same on average. Assuming they expect the low FICO customer to carry a balance and earn interest, it may make sense to accept a loss on the high FICO customer for risk management purposes.

The Economics of MS /u/kevlarlover I agree a more thorough explanation of the economics of MS would be very interesting! I just don't have the practical experience or knowledge with that to do a good job. You all have seemed to work out some pretty good explanations in the comments!

Interest Income It keeps coming up, so I'll elaborate more. I'm going to steal part of /u/deerburger 's comment here, because its great and I'm tired of original research (thank you kind stranger):

As of 9/30/16, JP Morgan made $2,014,000,000 in interchange fees and $1,215,000,000 in "credit card revenue". And they either included credit cards incentives in their marketing expenses of $663,000,000 or those incentives are accounted for separately and total under $361,000,000.

For Citibank, it's been tougher with just $1,410,000,000 in interchange fees and $1,140,000,000 in marketing.

Edit: And to be clear, these revenues don't include interest earned from the credit card portfolio. Those numbers were $2,218,000,000 and $11,377,000,000 for Chase and Citi, respectively.

So, Chase earns 110% of their interchange fees in interest. Citi earns 806% of their interchange fees in interest. Logically, Amex earns 0% of their interchange fees in interest for their Gold and Platinum charge cards. This highlights the fact that these companies all have different business models. In the same way that some car lots try to make money on the sale of the car, and others accept less profit on the car but try to make money sticking you with a bad note by getting you to finance in house, issuing banks reflect a diversity in the business model as well. As some have pointed out below, Citi targets the subprime consumer debt market. Surely, they have some higher costs associated with servicing and collecting that debt though. And, I'd again repeat the question, what is the incremental interest income associated with giving out rewards? I imagine a good chunk of Citi's customers would have carried that balance and paid into the $11,377,000,000 in interest revenue regardless of rewards. Certainly, interest income accounts for a lot of the card companies income, and for some it may subsidize the rewards programs. But, based on the fact that interchange fees are explicitly set up to vary with rewards categories, I'd imagine that when all our BFFs over at Chase run a profitability analysis for a new card offering, interchange fees is the first line, and incremental interest income is below that. Please feel free to disagree and contribute more information you may have below!

How much do banks actually pay for airline miles and points? I surmised that its less than retail. But how much less? I have no clue, and would love input below from anyone who does have first hand knowledge. I have knowledge that the cost to fulfill a point valued at $.01 retail is a little less than $.006 at the merchant I work for. But, that's retail, they can only be used on our products, and the margins on redemptions are pretty high.

How much of the interchange fee does MasterCard get? No clue on this one. Their website claims that they don't get any of it, but others have suggested that's just smoke and mirrors: banks separately remit fees back to MasterCard that are technically separate from the "interchange fees," but money is fungible. I'm not sure on this one, so more feedback would be appreciated.

Why did you use MasterCard in your example? Visa rules, MasterCard drools! Sorry everyone. That's just the most recent card I've churned. Lurking Visa reps... don't take it personally!

Why don't more merchants have cash discounts? / Are you saying credit cards provide no value to merchants??? Lies!!

Let me be clear: credit cards provide a huge value to merchants. Cash has a tendency to get stolen. If you have dispersed retail locations, you have to truck that stuff to a network of regional banks in armored vans (hopefully). Then, you have to finance the float between the time you received cash at a location, and the time that cash makes it to your main bank. Also, you can perform valuable customer analytics using a tokenized version of a card number to separate customers. E.g., when people buy this on one day, they tend to buy this other thing within a week, etc. I just don't think that value is what is responsible for driving up fees, and certainly I don't think the merchant gets anymore value when they receive payment via a higher fee rewards card.

This bums me out...the cash to credit transfer of wealth, and its correlation to income...ugh. I'm not going to take a moral stance on this--I just want to be informative. I will point out, however, that this isn't the only regressive transfer of wealth in our society.

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Ghetto_tax

On the other hand, those facts are intentionally combatted with things like progressive income taxes, and taxes on luxury goods. Some transfers are more obvious, and some are less obvious, but they exist. Another example that is similar to the transfer taking place with credit card use is the correlation between home ownership and income in LCOL areas. Without access to financing, many in lower income brackets don't participate in the potential net worth gains via home equity as inflation pushes up home prices, but the mortgage payments remain (often) fixed. Of course, the government attempts to address this by subsidizing loans to lower income individuals. Some would argue this contributed to the housing crisis. Some would take offense to that. Some would call the person that took offense to that a liberal wuss. The person that got called the liberal wuss may call the name caller a jerk-head conservative. I, of course, would withhold my opinion on these arguments entirely. Whether you agree or disagree with those public policy goals is your opinion!

The interchange fees ARE negotiable, and some businesses DON'T take MasterCard Fair, but how many? Enough to set the prices that most consumers pay in the economy? Probably not.

Banks and Card Networks make money on things besides interest and interchange fees. What role do those pay? Do they subsidize rewards? Probably some? Maybe? I don't know, and tbh, I'm kinda burnt out on looking stuff up. Maybe someone with firsthand knowledge could chime in. I'd hazard a guess they're much less significant though.

Banks don't lose money on points redeemed for stuff you wouldn't have bought in the first place There are a lot of factors at play here, and I'd tend to agree with the premise. That's why you can get such high bonus points through the shopping portal on things like flowers, wine clubs, etc. They are pretty sure you are creating new spending, not just shifting your payment method. The vendor providing the product service probably charges the bank a significant amount less than retail when you use your points, because they know this. If you want to go full nerd, google "Price Elasticity of Demand." These goods have a high price elasticity of demand, unlike stuff like gas, that you tend to buy no matter the price.

Access to credit is a good thing, it boosts the economy, and actually reduces prices I'm not gonna go down this macroeconomic rabbit hole. I don't disagree, but I'd argue that the access to credit that spurs economic growth would still exist in a world without these high rewards cards.

** Why doesn't MasterCard reclassify all their cards to the top tier and rake in the money?** I don't know. I'd imagine the government would have a field day and call it price fixing. Or, there would be some sort of mass revolt among merchants if the switch wasn't gradual. Certainly, these fees have risen over time across the board.

When are you going to stop editing this post and adding content Now. I hope I've incorporated most of the points that have been raised (thank you, really, for all the information and feedback). I'm not an expert from the issuing bank or card network side, so I know this post is destined to be less than perfect. I hope you all build on this knowledge and correct me in the comments below!

Just kidding

Links to sources showing that spending levels increase (controlled for household income) on rewards cards were posted in the comments. I've pasted the comment below:

Start with the article I linked above: http://web.mit.edu/simester/Public/Papers/Alwaysleavehome.pdf Then dig into the work it cites, one of the seminal papers in this field: https://www.uni-muenster.de/imperia/md/content/psyifp/aeechterhoff/wintersemester2011-12/vorlesungkommperskonflikt/feinberg_credcards_jouconres1986.pdf Though some researchers have had difficulty replicating the results: http://journals.sagepub.com/doi/pdf/10.2466/pr0.1990.67.1.323

Also I received a private message from an individual that works for an issuing bank. They gave me the green light to paraphrase their comments and add them to the post:

• "World High Value" Mastercard is a customer that spends more than $25K per year on the card. If you see cards that give some kind of bonus for spending big money (like $25k per year), that is probably why

• However the payments are structured, MasterCard keeps about one third of the interchange fee.

• The actual worst case for an issuer isn't us, its someone who runs up a balance on a card quickly and then ghosts. Often, this is either the result of identity theft, those with a terminal illness, or those intending to file for bankruptcy soon.

• It is pretty hard to detect churners, which is why the rules to prevent it are so "simple" (5/24, 6/6, 8/65, etc.)

• Different merchant categories are charged different interchange rates because the market will take it. It's just the result of leverage, not because of actual differences in cost. Also, bonus categories are usually offered to customers because that merchant category has a high fee, as opposed to the bonus categories causing the merchant category fee to be pushed up. Generally, bonus categories are created because one segment has a higher interchange, and not the other way around.

• Typically, anywhere from one-third to two-thirds of purchases are not paid off every statement, creating interest income for the issuer.

• The Sapphire Reserve may partially be a play for customers carrying interest, as Chase is approving $10K credit lines to consumers with middle of the road credit scores, who are likely to carry balances.

• Banks don't take on customers they believe will lose them money, but will take high-FICO customers who are less profitable than low-FICO customers. But, usually only if the average customer in that income/FICO bracket is profitable. If you hear stories of people with over 750 FICOs being (seemingly) randomly rejected for a card without being over 5/24 or some other well-known rule, it's probably because the bank's credit policy is targeting low-FICO or low-income customers.

• For MS, if you're profitable, the banks won't shut you down. That means it's easier to MS on cards with high interchange fees like business cards, and harder to do it on cards with higher rewards (like the Wells Fargo 5% card, or the Chase Ink+).

P2 told me we needed to have a serious conversation and asked me to come into the living room. I walk in and my entire family is sitting there. Mom, dad, P2, even my brother drove over. There’s a chair in the middle of the room facing everyone.

I immediately knew what this was about. The credit cards.

P2 starts crying and says “We’re worried about you.” I tell her I’m fine, and then she turns the laptop around. “We found your spreadsheets.”

Okay, first of all, going through my spreadsheets without permission is a massive invasion of privacy. There’s sensitive information in there, application dates, annual fee dates, credits I’ve used, onlyfans subs.

Then my dad puts a folder on the table. It’s full of my credit cards.

My mom asks why I have 37 of them. I explain that most are business cards and therefore don’t count. Nobody acknowledges this extremely important distinction. Dad asks why I opened three cards in one month. “Atmos” He just stares at me like I’m speaking another language.

My brother points at the spreadsheet. “It says here you spent $8,000 in three months just to get points.” No. I redirected $8,000 of organic spend. Completely different thing. I was going to spend that money anyway, eventually, probably.

Then P2 says, “Tell them about Staples.” I ask what about Staples. “Tell them how many times you went last week.” That has absolutely nothing to do with why we’re here.

My mom starts crying harder and dad asks if I’m gambling. I actually get offended. “Gambling has negative expected value. This is nothing like gambling.” Apparently that was “not the point.”

Then they tell me they’ve discussed it as a family and they want me to go 90 days without applying for a credit card. I laughed because I genuinely thought that was the part where everyone breaks character and tells me this was a joke.

Nobody laughed.

Dad finally says, “We just want the old you back. Before all the credit cards.” I tell him I understand. He asks me to promise that, at least for tonight, I won’t talk about points, credit cards, welcome bonuses, or referrals. I agree.

There’s a long silence. Mom wipes her eyes and asks if anybody wants pizza. Dad says he’ll order it. He pulls out his wallet. I see a debit card. I tried. I really fucking tried.

“Dad, before you pay for that, I have an Amex offer.”

P2 immediately gets up and walks out. Mom starts crying again. My brother calls me a fucking psychopath. Dad doesn’t say anything. He takes the folder full of my credit cards, walks over to the fireplace and throws it in. I jumped after it.

Dad grabs me before I can reach the fire and screams, “THIS IS WHY WE’RE HERE.”

That’s when P2 comes back holding a second folder and dumps a brick of Staples receipts onto the table.

“Forty-six receipts,” she says. “Four different Staples. Seven days.”

Dad looks at me. “You went to Staples forty-six times last week?”

“No. That would be insane.”

He actually looks relieved.

“Forty-six transactions. I only went twenty-three times.”

My mom gets up and leaves. My brother looks at the receipts. “Why the fuck would you go to four different Staples twenty-three times in a week?”

“Because the manager at the fifth one asked me to stop coming in.”

Nobody says anything. P2 just points at me and looks at my dad.

“THAT. THAT’S WHY WE’RE FUCKING HERE.”

Since we are all applying to many CCs, there is a high chance that your information was involved in the 2017 Equifax data breach. The settlement, which has a pot of almost $400 million, is now accepting claims. You could receive a flat $125 compensation and more for time spent handling the breach or financial losses. Info is below. Claims are open until January, and the process only takes about 5 minutes. Good luck!

Settlement website

Eligibility checker

FTC.gov press release

Edit: thank you for gold! Wasn't sure how this would go over on this sub but I felt it really impacted many of us.

My accountant asked how many credit cards I have.

I said, “personal or business?”

He closed his laptop.

Apparently that wasn't the clarification he was looking for.

I've been doing this long enough that I no longer perceive money as currency. Everything is either:

- spend

- organic spend

- manufactured spend

- wasted spend

- or WHY THE FUCK DID YOU PUT THAT ON THE 1X CARD

My P2 bought $186 of groceries yesterday using a debit card.

I haven't spoken to her since.

Not because I'm angry.

Because I need time to process betrayal.

---

I am currently 17/24.

Chase hasn't approved me for a credit card since the Obama administration.

I still check preapprovals.

You never know.

---

Amex put me in pop-up jail three years ago.

Every few months I apply again just to let them know I haven't forgotten.

Neither have they.

---

I have 2.8 million points.

I also have no points.

You understand.

1.1M MR

640k UR

390k AA

270k Hilton

180k C1

93k United

47k Alaska

31k Southwest

14k Wyndham

8,700 JetBlue

and approximately 600 points with an airline that ceased operations in 2019.

I refuse to transfer anything speculatively because points are a depreciating currency.

So instead I have been responsibly hoarding them for seven years while they depreciate.

---

Last week I found a business-class award to Tokyo for 60,000 points.

Perfect dates.

Perfect routing.

Two seats.

I did not book it.

Redemption value was only 2.7 cpp.

I'm not some fucking animal.

---

My friends think I travel for free.

My last “free” vacation required:

3 positioning flights

2 separate PNRs

4 transfer partners

an airport hotel

$436 in taxes

a 6:10 AM departure

a 13-hour layover

and landing 217 miles from where I actually wanted to go.

Cash ticket was $612 nonstop.

Saved $176.

This is why they hate us.

---

I haven't paid for airport food since 2018.

I will, however, walk 1.4 miles through three terminals to visit a Priority Pass restaurant before remembering that my particular Priority Pass doesn't include restaurants.

Then I will walk back.

This is called travel hacking.

---

My wallet contains:

Amex Gold

Amex Platinum

Business Platinum

BBP

CSR

CSP

CFU

CFF

Ink Cash

Ink Unlimited

Ink Preferred

Venture X

Savor

Bilt

Hyatt

AA

United

and one Discover card I keep around because we've been through too much together.

TSA asked why my wallet weighed 11 pounds.

I said:

“Multipliers.”

He waved over a supervisor.

---

I have opened so many Ink cards that Chase Business Relationship Manager is now listed as an emergency contact.

My “business” has:

$814 in lifetime revenue

$97,000 in available credit

and apparently requires another Ink Preferred every 91 days.

Nature is healing.

---

Every purchase requires a decision tree.

Restaurant?

Gold.

Unless hotel restaurant.

Then maybe hotel card.

Unless Resy.

Unless Amex Offer.

Unless Chase Offer.

Unless portal.

Unless gift card.

Unless working toward SUB.

Unless retention offer.

Unless quarterly category.

Unless merchant coding is weird.

Unless—

P2 HAS ALREADY PAID WITH THE FUCKING DEBIT CARD.

---

I once drove 14 minutes back to Home Depot because I realized I used a 2x card instead of the card I was putting spend on.

Difference:

83 points.

At 1.7 cpp that's $1.41.

Gas cost approximately $2.60.

But that's not relevant.

Principles matter.

---

I bought $50 of merchandise at Saks because Amex gave me $50.

I would never have purchased any of it otherwise.

Retail price: $78.

Credit: -$50.

Out of pocket: $28.

Therefore:

I made $50.

This is accounting.

---

Every December 31 my household becomes a distressed private-equity firm attempting to liquidate:

airline incidentals

Dell credits

Saks credits

Uber Cash

Resy credits

hotel credits

FNCs

TravelBank

DoorDash

Instacart

and twelve Amex Offers for wine I've never heard of.

At 11:43 PM I'm ordering $48 worth of Cheesecake Factory while purchasing a laptop from Dell.

My family calls it New Year's Eve.

I call it:

Q4 close.

---

I have spent approximately 900 hours learning this hobby.

Had I spent those hours developing a marketable skill, I could probably make another $50,000/year.

Instead I can tell you from memory which version of the Amex Platinum reimburses CLEAR.

So who's really winning?

Don't answer that.

---

Yesterday my bank called about “unusual activity.”

I asked:

“Which bank?”

There was a long silence.

Then:

“Sir, that's concerning.”

---

My credit score is 812.

My mental credit score is 436.

---

I currently have:

4 cards waiting for retention offers

3 FNCs expiring

2 cards approaching anniversary

1 Amex Offer I forgot to use

$37 in orphaned airline credit

and a Citi card that may or may not still exist.

But I have a spreadsheet.

The spreadsheet knows.

The spreadsheet has always known.

---

Anyway, quick question:

My cousin's roommate's LLC opened an Ink Preferred 88 days ago and he's currently 9/24 but two cards are AU accounts and one was opened during a lunar eclipse.

He has $7,843 of organic spend coming up because his transmission exploded.

Should he:

A) CIP

B) CIC

C) CIU

D) NLL Biz Plat

E) wait until he's under 5/24

F) divorce his wife and remarry her as P2

G) read the sidebar

Please respond quickly.

He's standing at the mechanic right now.

I have assigned a credit card to every president up to Reagan for either what card that president would carry or what card represents that president or presidency. I tried to leave politics out of it and did not include recent presidents on purpose. Almost all of this was done on memory so I am sure there are many errors, but oh well.

George Washington (1789-97): Amex Centurion Card, This card might not be the most useful card in day to day operations, but it is expensive and one of the most famous.

John Adams (1797-1801): Lowe's Business Rewards Card, Adams moved into the President’s House which was not cheap to build and furnish. The Lowe's Business Rewards Card would have really helped offset the cost of the President’s House to the new nation.

Thomas Jefferson (1801-09): BlockFi Visa Card, This card is attempting to change the economic system by giving rewards in crypto currency, just like Jefferson left his impact on the US economic system

James Madison (1809-17): Firefighters Credit Union Visa Classic, The British burned Washington and the President’s House. Having the Firefighters Credit Union Visa Classic card would nit have put out the fires, but it would have supported the firefighters who ultimately did help put out the burning city.

James Monroe (1817-25): Chase Sapphire Preferred, Monroe established the US’s first foreign policy and toured the colonies. He would have not needed a “premium” travel card since his foreign policy was not geared towards foreign travel and he never left the country.

John Quincy Adams (1825-29): Comenity Pottery Barn Credit Card, Adams was the first president live White House and the thriving country could afford furnishings to the White House that did not come from Ikea.

Andrew Jackson (1829-37): Cheese Debit Card, Jackson kept a 1,400 pound wheel of cheddar in the White House lobby for 2 years.

Martin Van Buren (1837-41): Banco Popular Premia Card, Van Buren was the only president to not speak English as first language. The Premia Card is one of the few US issued cards not in English.

John Tyler (1841-45): Walmart Visa Card, If Walmart was around in the 1840’s, penny pinching John Tyler would have their credit card in the front of his billfold.

James K. Polk (1845-49): Chase World of Hyatt Credit Card, Polk expanded USA by 1.2 million acres and he was known to enjoy luxury. Nothing better than staying in luxury hotels while traveling. He never left the USA so he did not need a hotel card with a big international footprint.

Zachary Taylor (1849-50): Bank of America American Quarter Horse Association Credit Card, Taylor’s horse, Old Whitey, was arguably more popular than he was. Old Whitey would have loved having the Bank of America American Quarter Horse Association Credit Card.

Millard Fillmore (1850-1853): FNBO Evergreen Visa, I know nothing about this card like I know nothing about Fillmore’s presidency.

Franklin Pierce (1853-57): UBS Preferred Visa Signature, Pierce was not a good president and the UBS Preferred Visa Signature Card is equally as terrible sporting a $495 AF, minimal rewards, minimal benefits, tiny SUB, and high fees.

James Buchanan (1857-61): Mastercard Black Card, An expensive useless card to match a president that liked the finer things in life, but was rather useless as a president.

Abraham Lincoln (1861-65): United Presidential Plus Card, A president that was forced to make many presidential decisions during his time in office. He also is one of ~8 presidents that died in office.

Andrew Johnson (1865-69): Trendsetter Rewards Credit Card, Johnson was known as the best dressed president and the fashion focused Trendsetter Rewards Credit Card would have been right up his alley. He at one point was a tailors apprentice and if the fashion was not up to his standards would make his own cloths, setting trends in presidential fashion.

Ulysses S. Grant (1869-77): Green America Visa, Both spent a lot of effort and money on environmental issues including pushing through the National Park system.

Rutherford B. Hayes (1877-1881): The Plum Card from American Express, Nothing is more fitting for The Plum Card for Hayes who was known for being a peach of a guy.

James Garfield (1881): Discover It Secured, Garfield grew up poor and died poor. His FICO score is unknown.

Chester Arthur (1881-85): Chase Freedom Unlimited, Arthur is known for being a very average president and nothing like the very average Chase Freedom Unlimited for him.

Grover Cleveland (1885-89): Royal Caribbean Visa, Cleveland had secret surgery on a boat when he disappeared for 4 days. The the Royal Caribbean Visa, you can disappear on a boat for 4 days.

Benjamin Harrison (1989-93): Capital One Spark Business Card, Harrison has the distinction of bringing electricity to the White House. The Spark Business Card is the perfect card to add that spark to the White House.

Grover Cleveland (1893-97):  Royal Caribbean Visa, Cleveland had secret surgery on a boat when he disappeared for 4 days. The the Royal Caribbean Visa, you can disappear on a boat for 4 days.

William McKinley (1897-1901): Citi AAdvantage Platinum Select, Citi instigated a short war between AA and churners which resulted in a one sided battle with AA having all the leverage. The final conclusion was resolved via lawyers. McKinley started the Spanish-American War, which was rather one sided and only lasted a few months before lawyers drafted the treaty.

Theodore Roosevelt (1901-09): US Bank Altitude Reserve, The first president to leave the country while in office on a trip to Panama is like the Altitude Reserve. Since the international trips were so few, not all of the perks of some of the other premium cards are needed.

William Howard Taft (1909-13): American Express Business Platinum, Taft got federal taxes roaring and we all know there is not better way* to meet the American Express Business Platinum MSR than paying your taxes

Woodrow Wilson (1913-21): Chase Freedom, Wilson’s promise of a “New Freedom” meshes well with the Chase Freedom card. Wilson worked to regulate banking and the Chase Freedom is an old card that has withstood the test of time in the banking world.

Warren Harding (1921-23): American Express Business Gold, Harding was a businessman by trade and sported size 19 feet. He wasn’t baller enough for the Amex Business Platinum, but would have been the Gold. He supported big business and disagreed with a minimum wage.

Calvin Coolidge (1923-29): Bryant Heating & Cooling Systems Credit Card, You need some AC in the hot summer months to “Keep Cool with Coolidge”

Herbert Hoover (1929-33): Capital One Platinum Mastercard, Presiding over the Great Depression, many people in the country needed the Capital One Platinum Mastercard to help build their credit during and after the depression.

Franklin D. Roosevelt (1933-45): Chase United Club, the first miles card to offer more than 1 miles/dollar, offering a whopping 1.5 miles/dollar. This was pretty revolutionary during the time, but seems pretty ho hum now.

Harry S. Truman (1945-53): Amex Hilton Aspire, Truman began his life poor and the presidency brought him much glitz, glamour, and attention just like the Aspire will do. Transporting peons to the ranks of elite with instant top tier Diamond Status.

Dwight D. Eisenhower (1953-61): American Express Platinum, If platinum was a military rank, Eisenhower would have achieved it. Eisenhower was a household name before and after he became president, just like the American Express Platinum is one of the most recognizable credit cards out there today.

John F. Kennedy (1961-63): Nasa Federal Credit Union Visa Classic, Back in Kennedy’s day “to the moon” meant something very different than on r/wallstreetbets. He promised to put a man on the moon by 1970 and that accomplished in ’69.

Lyndon B. Johnson (1963-69): CareCredit Credit Card, Johnson got Medicare and Medicaid off the ground and CareCredit charges exorbitant interest for medical expenses.

Richard Nixon (1969-74): Citi Prestige, Like Nixon, the Citi Prestige started its life full of benefits and was one of the great cards. The card then went drastically downhill and while not mired in scandal, it is relegated to the trash heap with its current benefits.

Gerald Ford (1974-77): PayPal Key, Ford was not elected president or Vice President, but become the president. Just like PayPal Key can become a credit card even though it isn’t one.

Jimmy Carter (1977-81): Citi Double Cash, Carter was known for being frugal and sold the presidential yacht due to the upkeep bill (a cruise card would not be up his alley). The annual fee free Citi Double Cash would be penny pinching Carter’s pick.

Ronald Reagan (1981-89): Ducks Unlimited Visa, Reagan said that he “forgot to duck” after getting shot. If only he had the Ducks Unlimited Visa in his billfold that would have not been an issue.

Please leave the politics out of it and let's leave the presidents of the last 30 years out of it too. I meant this as a second grade maturity level post and not an adult politics post.

(This will be my last front page post of the purge and I am sure there are 37 grammatical errors due to voice to text and not caring enough to proof read)

5/9/2017 EDIT: The below is the draft version of the chart. Be sure to check out the final version here: https://www.reddit.com/r/churning/comments/5wsvzr/faq_credit_card_recommendation_flowchart/

For those of you who spend any time in the What Card Weekly thread, you know that the advice there is very often quite repetitive, since there is generally one optimal card application path to maximize your churning profits, with only minor variations from that path.

This week, I got tired of typing the same thing over and over again, so I sat down and took 45 minutes to type out a flowchart that covers 90%-95% of the advice I find myself giving in WCW every week, over and over again.

Check out the first draft of the flowchart here!

The mods suggested that I post it here for feedback, and once it gets another round of edits based on the sub's feedback, they'll figure out how best to use it.

Things to keep in mind:

1. I made this chart with an eye towards maximizing overall credit card application returns; it doesn't (and won't) take into account trying to get to a particular location or a particular redemption at the expense of total sign-up bonus returns.

2. The valuations of most valuable -> less valuable CC sign-up bonuses are obviously subjective. So, feedback like "the Capital One Venture card is obviously more valuable than the Amex Delta cards" isn't particularly helpful, but if I've left off a killer card that should definitely be on the list, or if there's a serious argument to be made that a card at the bottom of the list should be at the top, that's definitely helpful.

3. Anything key that's missing!

If the flowchart becomes a useful tool, it will be easy to update as new cards come and old cards are discontinued, but the idea is for it to provide guidance that is accurate for most new and new-ish churners in most situations (and, I hope, lessen the amount of typing I do in WCW).

If you're at 40+/24, it probably won't help you much - but please provide feedback to make it better :D

And my many thanks to all of you in the sub for contributing in ways big and small to all the free travel I'm doing this year!

EDIT: Thanks for the gold, kind stranger!

Demo gif: https://i.imgur.com/6TQjwsI.mp4

Debbit is a set it and forget it solution to automating monthly transaction count requirements. Debbit does this by purchasing 50 cent Amazon gift cards and/or paying your cable bill in small increments multiple times throughout the month. Some example usages are:

> High interest checking accounts

High interest checking accounts offer up to a 5% risk free return on your balance each year. Often these accounts require some amount of monthly debit card transactions to qualify. I use Debbit to automate 60 debit transactions per month on bills I would have paid anyway to qualify for a 5% return on my $20,000 balance. Free $1000 per year! This Doctor of Credit page contains links to regional and nationwide high interest checking accounts.

> Prevent credit card closures from inactivity

Some banks will close out credit cards due to inactivity. Use Debbit to automatically schedule 1 tiny transaction per month for all your sock drawer credit cards. This Doctor of Credit page has more info on banks closing credit cards due to inactivity.

> Get $.99 per card per month for free

Many (most?) banks will waive your credit card bill if your balance is less than $1. Use Debbit to schedule one $.99 Amazon gift card reload per month for all your sock drawer credit cards. This Doctor of Credit page has more info on small balance waiver.

Download for mac/windows/linux

• https://github.com/jakehilborn/debbit/releases

Debbit Features:

• Anti account lockout: Debbit will spread purchases through the month with some randomness in timing and amount spent. These controls prevent Debbit from spamming your accounts with too many transactions too quickly or too similarly.

• Fault tolerant: Start up or shut down Debbit at any time. Debbit saves important state to your hard drive and will auto-adjust its spending to fit the time left in the month. It doesn't matter if you start Debbit on the 1st or the 15th of the month, it will adjust its scheduling accordingly.

• Built in support: If amazon/xfinity/at&t/optimum/etc changes their website and Debbit stops working, it will generate error logs to describe the issue. All passwords & cc details are automatically removed from the logs. There is no built-in error uploads so you'll have to email the files or create an Issue on GitHub to share.

• Private: There are no analytics or anything uploading data anywhere.

Debbit v2.0 Update [6/17/2020] FAQ Here

New Features:

• Support for multiple debit/credit cards.

• Cookie support. Firefox stays logged in to avoid captchas.

• Email notifications for when Debbit fails.

• Instructions to auto-run Debbit on computer start up.

• Plug-in support for adding new merchants.

Merchants:

• Amazon gift card reload (anti-automation challenge, captcha, and two-factor auth now supported)

• Xfinity bill pay

• New: AT&T Bill Pay

• New: Optimum Bill Pay

Let me know y'all's thoughts. Happy to implement suggestions to make this thing useful. Also sorry if I'm breaking any of churning's rules here. I've been lurking for a while but figured I had to post. Where else on the internet than here would be into this kind of thing?

https://www.wsj.com/articles/free-credit-freezes-coming-for-all-u-s-consumers-1520505001

Consumers are on track to get one thing from Congress in response to last year’s massive Equifax Inc: free freezes of their data held by the credit-reporting companies.

The bipartisan agreement, set to be approved in the Senate by next week as part of a broader banking bill, would require credit-reporting companies to let consumers block access to their credit reports to potential lenders without paying a fee. Freezing access to credit data is a crucial measure consumers can take if they want to protect themselves from identity theft.

Credit-reporting firms are mixed about the measure, which would erode a source of revenue, while consumer advocates worry it doesn’t go far enough to give people more control over their data.

The provision would set a single national standard for credit freezes. Currently, 42 states allow credit-reporting firms to charge for the service unless an individual was a victim of identity theft. Eight states and the District of Columbia mandate waiver of the fees under all circumstances.

The U.S. has three main reporting companies—Equifax, Experian EXPGY 1.39% PLC and TransUnion TRU 1.08% —that typically charge $10 or less each to freeze or reinstate credit-data access, depending on a patchwork of state laws. The measure bars fees for both.

Under the provision, credit-reporting firms would have to place the freeze within one to three days after receiving a consumer’s request. Consumers would also be able to unfreeze their credit within an hour, if the process is requested electronically, or three days if requested by mail.

Consumer groups are concerned the measure would override future efforts by states to implement stricter freeze requirements on credit-reporting firms—for instance, making credit freezes a default setting for credit reports, essentially requiring consumers to approve any credit inquiry from potential lenders.

“It’s stopping the states from doing anything better in the future, and that’s a problem,” said Mike Litt, a director at U.S. PIRG, a consumer-rights group.

Sen. Mark Warner (D., Va.), one of the chief sponsors of the broader Senate bill, said he regretted the legislation—the result of a compromise between the political parties—doesn’t do more to rein in credit-reporting companies.

“They have all of our personal information,” Mr. Warner said. “And there are not clear standards and clear penalties.”

The credit-reporting firms have accepted the change is coming. “This is likely to be Congress’s opportunity to address the credit-reporting industry,” said Francis Creighton, head of the Consumer Data Industry Association, a trade group that represents credit-reporting companies.

“We think it’s fair that we’re able to charge a fee on a freeze,” Mr. Creighton, said. But, “given that [policy makers] don’t agree with us, this bill is perfectly reasonable,” he added.

“We are not upset with the provision of the proposed law. We support a federal security freeze statute that simplifies the process for consumers,” Experian said.

The provision likely will result in credit-reporting firms pitching credit-monitoring and other subscription-based services, according to a person familiar with the matter. People who contact the firms to sign up for the freeze will likely be marketed services that have a monthly fee attached to them, the person said.

Credit-reporting firms don’t break out what share of their revenue comes from credit freezes, though an industry executive says it is much smaller than other services they sell consumers, such as credit monitoring and identity-theft protection. But removing freeze fees would eliminate funds some of the companies say they use to help cover the costs associated with the freezes, including maintaining call centers. In some cases, the companies incur losses from the service.

The provision’s impact likely extends to lenders who receive loan applications from consumers with frozen reports. In some cases, lenders that contact the firms for the applicant’s credit reports and receive a notice that the report is frozen will still pay for that service. The lenders in most cases wouldn’t move forward with the loan application without a credit report.

Some firms are letting consumers place limits on their credit reports at no cost. Equifax and TransUnion offer a free service that allows consumers to lock and unlock their credit reports, while Experian charges for it. Locks are similar to credit freezes in helping to block identity thieves from obtaining financing in another person’s name. While they offer more convenience, such as control of data via an app, locks also give consumers less legal protection, consumer advocates say.

The credit-freeze provision is one of several proposals circulating in Congress since last year’s disclosure of the massive Equifax hack, which compromised the personal information of 147.9 million people. Many of the proposals go further than this bipartisan deal, with provisions to impose stricter regulatory oversight on the credit bureaus, charge penalties in the event of further breaches, or establish credit freezes as the default option for consumers.

Equifax itself hasn’t been able to shake off condemnation from policy makers and is the subject of several government probes. It also has upset its competitors. Experian and TransUnion believe the freeze legislation wouldn’t have materialized without the Equifax breach, according to the person familiar with the matter.

A fellow churner & MSer, my 84 year-old Mother, passed away suddenly of heart failure at the end of July. She'd been doing both since the 1970's (became an AA million-miler using the no longer doable "purchase AAA Travelers Checks with a credit card, deposit Travelers checks in bank account, pay off credit card well before due date, earn those AA miles at 1:1 since no multipliers way back then, rinse + repeat"). And more recently was still MSing a bit monthly via Plastiq.

This is a tale of what to do (or not to do) while churning, to keep your family or executors from having one heck of a mess to clean up, because something like this can potentially happen to you.

Here we go, in no particular order:

---She has a churner son (me), which makes things a whole lot easier! I knew there would be a lot of credit cards, autopays, Plastiq action, etc. Without me there my brother would potentially be freaking out with "what the heck did my 84 year-old Mom just spend $1,865- on only 5 days before she died with some company called Plastiq!!!" (it was a property tax payment so no big deal). So educate the heck out of someone in your family or circle if one of them isn't a churner, and get them to at least somewhat understand our crazy hobby…and also where you keep things.

---She made both of us aware that she had a fair amount of credit cards, + not to worry because she managed them well (that part was more for my brother the non-churner), and where all the cards that she didn’t carry were kept. Her 18-ish credit/charge cards total card count was easily verified using AW and CK, and then by accessing each card family online via the password list she periodically sent us. And we went looking for the large card sleeve of credit cards in her office that had all of her cards + also all the grandkid's AU cards that were in it too (AU cards to get them good credit in life early...her grandkids didn't get access to the cards though).

---She periodically forwarded my brother and me a password list for all the cards, loyalty programs, 6 different bank accounts, mortgage, VPN, etc. So we had relatively recent password lists that we could use...and while a lot of them weren't just listed out (ie, pw = 12345") and were only hints, we could either figure them out or use her laptop / cell phone combo to auto sign in or do the “forgot my password” thing and reset it. So, make, keep & forward your password lists to someone you trust, or use Lastpass or equivalent instead and make sure someone knows how to get into it.

---Points / miles totals: I easily got up to date on her 2.4 million points/miles total via AW, but brother as a non-churner would've had a problem finding them, and likely would've never found most or even used them. I also canceled her one Delta flight (she had plat status so no big deal) and her 7 IHG room reservations because I knew to check each loyalty account. Again, educate someone so that they know where to look. You don’t want the points sitting there unused until they expire. Oh, and I looked for and found her free hotel night certs too...we have 8 Marriott free nights and 2 IHG free nights of hers to use up.

---She’d said semi-regularly to both of us “If I ever die don’t you dare cancel my loyalty programs or tell them I'm dead until you make sure that you’ve either transferred the points out if you can, or instead used up all of my points/miles. And don’t cancel any of my credit cards that hold AMEX MR or Chase UR or Citi $ (Double Cash) until you’ve used or figured out how to move the points”.

---She had (has) most of her credit cards and her utilities/cable & remaining mortgage on autopay, which makes things less of a hassle for us as we don’t need or want to immediately cancel them because we’d then have to figure out which bank accounts her main home and two rental condos’ electric, gas, cable, etc bills were paid through. Do that autopay thing!

NON-CHURNING RELATED

---Keep a list of absolutely everything you both own and also owe, and make sure someone knows where it is. She used Fidelity Fullview for that, but you can just as easily write it on a sheet of paper, circle it in red, and put it with your will. Mom and I had just updated her Fullview three weeks before she died, so everything was on there (primary home, 2 rental condos, 1 mortgage she owed on, 1 land contract she was getting paid on, 2 cars with VIN #’s, the 6 bank accounts at 5 different banks, and the various Fidelity investment accounts that automatically populated into Fullview, etc). Tip: Print out Fullview or equiv BEFORE you call Fidelity or equiv to tell them someone has passed away. When I told Fidelity that mom had passed away they immediately locked down her accounts and sign on so that no one could ever access it again…so, no seeing Fullview. Yes, I’d printed it out before I called them.

---Make sure key people in your life know where you keep your will & (living) trust, and keep these lists that we’re talking about above with your will/trust. And if you don’t have them, or at least a will, then get one! Less hassle for your family if you die = good. And you definitely don’t want to make your family do the probate thing if you die without a will; I’m dealing with probate with my wife’s brother's estate currently and it’s a whole lot tougher.

TLDR: Get your sh_t in order churning-wise with lists and notes, to the extent that even a non-churner can figure it out if something should happen to you by using your lists & notes. And make sure they know where all these things are…and where you keep that overflowing sock drawer of credit cards too!

P.S. Off topic, but I'm actually glad that it looks like there's not going to be a Chicago Seminars conference this October. Living in separate states, Chicago Seminars gave us a chance to spend some time together each fall, and we'd attended for seven straight years I think...and always picked up several good tips. Would be too tough to show up there this year I think; too soon.

Edit: Thanks for all the kind comments and words of condolence; they're much appreciated. And I'm glad this post seems to be useful to a lot of you too. Mom would've gotten a kick out of reading all your thoughts! She will be very much missed.

Guide to a Cheap Vacation for Newbies

Introduction

The landscape of this game has changed a lot since the February version came out. Official wording of 5/24, Citi's 1/24, Amex MR clawback, CS(R) release, and the SPG/Marriott merger just to name a handful. As a result it is time to do an update.

Update: Factoring in lower CS(R) sign up bonus.

Thanks to /u/LumpyLump76 for the previous updates.

Please keep in mind that I am not a personal financial adviser. Just an individual who enjoys this hobby and wants to share some of the knowledge I've accumulated over the past couple of years in a fairly straightforward way.

There are a number of cards that people really should get up front. Remember, the goal here is not to maximize your points, but just get a mostly free vacation paid using credit card bonuses. You'll still have to pay for the miscellaneous travel expenses like visiting museums, shopping, dining, etc., so be sure to factor that in when planning your vacation.

A lot of this guide mirrors my own personal preference and may not mesh with yours and definitely not with the general credit card using public. I don't apply for more than a couple of cards at a time, I don't do manufactured spending, I try and maintain a state of equilibrium with the banks, and I've paid more than my fair share of annual fees. You, the reader, are free to disagree and I encourage healthy discussion in the comments section below.

Important Note: You don't have to follow this calendar exactly. The only reason I'm spacing out by 3 months is so that most people can meet the minimum spend without overextending themselves. Of course you can expedite the process or even apply for 2-3 cards at the same time as long as you can comfortably meet the minimum spend. From a personal perspective I apply for a new card around every 1-2 months depending upon the minimum spend and I've resigned myself to the fact I'll never be able to get another 5/24 Chase card.

Required reading before you start:

• The Wiki

• The sub rules

• Why you should not start churning

• Miles vs Points

• What Card should I Get/Use

• Beginner's Chase Guide under 5/24

• Credit Card Decision Flowchart

Goal

The goal is to get a cheap vacation in the continental United states, with flight and hotels paid for entirely with points and bonuses with perspective for some international trips. If you follow the guide, you should end up with a better credit score, larger credit line, and the freedom to take advantage of limited time offers.

I'm sure you know this, but cheap vacation in the continental US is super broad and that most of you are also planning international travel. Before you jump in please have a particular plan or destination and use resources like Awardhacker and Awardmapper to help guide your credit card strategy. What is below is a catch all because it factors in the highest sign up bonuses and also includes the largest airline alliance (United and the Star Alliance) and the largest hotel group (Marriott+SPG) as transfer partners.

Your credit scores will likely drop 3-5 points after each application due to the hard inquiry and decreased average age of account, but you could feasibly break even with your decreased utilization (increased credit limit) and increase in number of accounts. If you handle credit correctly, the score will improve steady over time. If your credit score drops significantly more, stop and figure out what you are doing wrong. You can find out more information at Annual Credit Report and CreditKarma among others. Do not start on this plan if you plan to get a mortgage in the next 12 months and/or a car loan in the next 6 months.

Pre-requisite

Like all things in life, you have to meet some requirements before you start.

• Monthly Spend: You should be able to safely spend $1,500 a month on Food, Gas, Insurance, Rent, etc. or have a large purchase coming up. If your monthly spend is much less, you probably aren't ready for this yet.

• Emergency Fund: Do you have at least 3 months of living money set aside? If not, don't start until you do. You may need to float money onto a credit card, or have your money tied up in the wrong place.

• If you have credit card or personal loan debt: Don't start churning until you pay those off. Exceptions can be made if you have a mortgage, auto loan, student loans, etc. that are under control.

• Your credit score: You can find your credit report at Annual Credit Report and several banks provide your FICO as a benefit, but you can also find an estimate through services like CreditKarma. Ideally your score is over 720.

• Your credit history: You should already have 1 or 2 existing credit lines, for at least 2 years. If you don't, wait until you do, since it is usually harder to qualify for reward cards. It is possible to circumvent if you have a high annual income and/or a long standing relationship with the bank.

• Have a method for keeping track: The standard method is using a spreadsheet to track each card application date, annual fee, minimum spend, minimum spend date, and how much you actually spent. There are other methods, but I personally use a combination of a to-do app linked to my Outlook calendar and Mint so I can keep an eye on the go.

The Plan

This plan is current as of December 2016. This plan will have to be modified as CC offers comes and goes. When applying for cards, always try to see if there are referrals or better deals on this sub. Please be so kind as to use one of the referrals from the community or PM a member who helped you out if you do in fact jump in. It definitely helps us out and one less referral to bloggers that push certain cards without consideration of the person on the other side of the screen the better.

Day 0

To start on this plan you need to do some prep work. You should go to the following websites, and sign up for each companies Frequent Customer program. Note down your Program ID, username, and password and do not recycle passwords (I personally recommend using a password manager of some type like 1Password or LastPass). You will need this information as you apply for affiliated credit cards, or when you want to transfer points to these programs. The most common method of keeping track is AwardWallet (they don't cover United, Delta, or Southwest as a heads up), but you can do it manually as well.

• www.aa.com: AAdvantage

• www.alaskaair.com: Mileage Plan

• www.ba.com: British Airways Executive Club

• www.delta.com: SkyMiles

• www.flyingblue.com: Air France/KLM Flying Blue

• www.jetblue.com: TrueBlue

• www.koreanair.com: SkyPass

• www.southwest.com: Rapid Rewards

• www.united.com: MileagePlus

• www.ihg.com: Intercontinental Rewards Club

• www.marriott.com: Marriott Rewards

• www.hilton.com: HHonors

• www.hyatt.com: Gold Passport

• www.spg.com: Starpoints

One benefit about signing up these programs, is that they often will email invitation to various deals, but be sure to do your due diligence because it sometimes isn't always the best one. Double check in this sub and the Current credit card offers before applying.

Day 1 : Chase Sapphire Reserve (CS(R)) You can find the 100K UR offer in a physical Chase branch, since the current online offer has been lowered to 50K. Only offer is 50K, but still an excellent sign up bonus. There might be targeted 100K offers in the future, but it's too soon to say.

After meeting the minimum spend of $4,000 over 3 months you will have 54,000 UR points. This is worth:

• $540 in cash back

• $300 in travel statement credit per calendar year

• $810 in travel through the Chase Travel Portal

• 2 RT domestic tickets by transferring to Southwest, United, British Airways (fly on AA or Alaska), or Flying Blue (fly on Delta).

• 2 RT continental US to Hawaii on Korean Air (fly on Delta)

This card is the the first card you should get due to Chase's 5/24, which is explained in the Chase Megathread. We are going to move onto more Chase cards soon, so make sure you keep putting some spend on the CS(R), and pay it off monthly. This card does have an AF of $450, comes with $300 travel credit every calendar year (includes taxis, public transit, and plane tickets among others), GE/TSA application reimbursement, and lounge access with no guest limits.

The things you should pay with the CS(R):

• Airline tickets and hotel stays (both full price and for taxes/fees on award redemptions) due to Trip Protection/Interruption Insurance

• Rental Cars due to Primary Rental Auto Insurance (requires paying for the rental car in full in either cash or UR)

• Dining out when not meeting the minimum spend on another card (it is one of two cards with 3x on dining and one of two cards with 3x on all travel)

Always pay off your statement balance in full each month. You should never pay less than the full statement balance. If you can't pay the full statement balance for whatever reason you should stop immediately, since you aren't ready for this hobby. If you are spending more than you typically do, then slow down and reconsider before jumping in.

Day 91: Chase Sapphire Preferred (CSP)

Apply for the Chase Sapphire Preferred second and add an authorized user. After meeting the minimum spend of $4,000 over 3 months (and one authorized user purchase) you will have 59,000 UR points. This is worth:

• $590 in cash back

• $885 in travel through the Chase Travel Portal if you have the CS(R) => has a 50% bonus on travel

• 2 RT domestic trips by transferring to Southwest, United, British Airways (fly on AA or Alaska), or Flying Blue (fly on Delta).

• 2 RT continental US to Hawaii on Korean Air (fly on Delta)

Keep in mind that the CS(R) and CSP have the exact same bonus categories, but the CS(R) has a better earn rate at 3x instead of 2x, so you'll find yourself never using the CSP after meeting the minimum spend. At the end of the first year feel free to product convert to a no annual fee card like the Freedom or Freedom Unlimited.

Day 181: Chase United MileagePlus Explorer (MPE)

Apply for the Chase MPE and add an authorized user. After meeting the minimum spend of $2,000 over 3 months (and one authorized user purchase) you will have 57,000 United miles. It has an annual fee of $95 that is waived the first year, but it comes with free checked bag, more saver award availability, and early boarding.

The 57,000 miles are worth 2 RT domestic tickets and only 3,000 short of a RT to Europe. They also have interesting award chart possibilities with open-jaws.

You can find the 50,000 offer through dummy bookings on the United site, United MPX purchase, in a physical Chase branch, or as a targeted mailer. It does show up as a public offer from time to time, but it's not consistent.

Day 271: Chase Marriott

Apply for the Chase Marriott card and add an authorized user. After meeting the minimum spend of $3,000 over 3 months (and one authorized user purchase) you will have 90,500 Marriott points. It does have an annual fee of $85 that is not waived, but it does come with a 1-night certificate every anniversary, but is more limited as you can only use it in a category 1-5 Marriott property. This certificate is less valuable as Marriott continues to devalue their program, but for domestic traveling and a bit of flexibility, you should still be able to get decent value out of the $85.

The 90,500 points are worth:

• 12 nights at a category 1

• 3 nights at a category 5

• 2 nights at a category 9

• The above is assuming standard point requirements. They do have point saver rewards that require a little bit less.

Day 361: Amex Starwood Preferred Guest (SPG)

Apply for the Amex SPG card if you can find the 25,000 or higher offer. After meeting the minimum spend of $3,000 over 3 months you will have 28,000 SPG points. It has an annual fee of $95 that is waived the first year. The interesting change to this card is with the recent SPG/Marriott merger 1 SPG point = 3 Marriott points and vice versa.

The 28,000 points are worth:

• 9 nights at a category 1

• 4 nights at a category 3

• 1 night at a category 6

There is a Megathread on the Southwest Companion pass. If you fly or plan on flying Southwest frequently and will have at least 1 other person with you, the Companion Pass (CP) is a phenomenal deal. However, due to Chase's new rules, getting the CP would mean you have to forgo 2-3 cards. If the CP is your top priority, apply to those first, but you might not be able to get some of the other cards.

What you have so far.

At this point, you should have accumulated the following:

• 163,000 Chase UR Points: $2,445 through UR portal, 6+ RT domestic on the transfer partners, or $1,630 cash back

• 57,000 United miles: 2 domestic RT, 1RT to Northern South America, 3K short of a RT to Europe/Southern South America, 13K short of a RT to North Asia/Japan, and 23K short of a RT to Africa/South Asia/Oceania (you can transfer over UR to make up the differences)

• 90,500 Marriott points (depends upon the category, but 2-3 nights for decent properties)

• 28,000 SPG points (depends upon the category, but 2-3 nights for decent properties)

You can be highly creative with this point balance, since Chase UR (when you hold the CS(R) or CSP) can be transferred 1:1 to United and Marriott among others. You also have access to both Marriott's and SPG's flights and nights program, which can make for interesting redemptions.

Important to note. If you value the Southwest Companion Pass (110K RR points in a calendar year) you can also acquire it through the Marriott Flights and Nights Hotel+Air Package 3. 270K Marriott points for 7 nights at a category 1-5 hotel and 120K RR points. With the points acquired in the guide above you can easily meet that point requirement with change to spare. No longer an option

• Chase UR FAQ

• Awardmapper for hotel locations

• Awardhacker for flights

• /r/awardtravel for help/inspiration

Note that the plan calls for a new card every 3 months, plenty of time to meet your minimum spend. You shouldn't have to do MS to try to meet the minimum spend. This plan also gives you flexibility to change. For example, if an Amex, Barclay, or Citi card pops up with a great offer, you can jump without worrying about too many hard inquiries or new accounts. Just note that if you add a card into the mix, delay the rest of the plan appropriately so you keep the hard inquiries and spacing in place. Note that once you've been approved for 5 cards overall in the last 24 months, you would be locked out of several Chase products (list here) until the approval date for the most recent card falls outside of 24 months.

Keep in mind that you can speed up this time frame if you can spend or MS the minimum spend before the 3 month mark or supplant one or two of the cards for those that is better suited for your needs. It's entirely possible that you can get 12+ cards in a calendar year and your plans as a result will change.

After you meet the minimum spend on each card, spread the remaining spends across all your active cards to the bonus categories that make sense. Also be sure to not neglect the cards you've collected, since banks can and will shutdown accounts that don't have activity. The general recommendation is to put a small purchase (pack of gum, cup of coffee, or loading $1 onto your Amazon gift balance all work) on it every 6-12 months or so just in case.

What do you do with all these cards after you get the bonus?

Hotel cards like IHG, Marriott, and Hyatt typically have good annual benefits (1 annual free night certificate) and is generally worth keeping and paying the AF. The United MPE is a good product if you fly United frequently, otherwise product convert to the no annual fee MileagePlus and save yourself $95. Both the CS(R) and CSP have some great benefits outside of earnings (both offer the valuable 1:1 transfer ratio), but there is no point holding both so it is up to you which one you want to keep. I am keeping my CS(R) with it's $300 annual travel credit + lounge access and have already product changed my CSP to the Freedom Unlimited which has no annual fee.

I'm done with the the plan. Now What?

You are probably hooked as many of the subscribers are and are free to join us. Continue to read the wiki and sidebar. Please read the rules before submitting posts (speaking as a mod and a long standing member of the community we're pretty strict and not always the friendliest to newbies).

The following cards are worth looking into for benefits and sign up bonuses:

• Chase British Airways 50K+

• Chase Ritz-Carlton 3 free nights

• Chase IHG 60K+

• Chase Hyatt 2 free nights

• Amex EDP 30K

• Amex PRG 50K

• Amex Platinum 100K (targeted/preapproval)

• Amex Hilton Surpass 85K+

• Citi Hilton 75K

• Citi Hilton Reserve 2 free nights

• Citi Prestige 50K

• Citi TY Premier 40K

• Citi AA Platinum 50K

• Citi AA Executive 60K

• Barclays Arrival Plus 50K

• Barclays JetBlue Plus 30K

• Capital One Venture 40K

• Bank of America Alaska Air 30K

Important notes:

• If you are comfortable for applying to business cards go for the Ink Preferred and it's 80K UR offer instead of the Amex SPG. Ink Preferred also falls under the 5/24 and it's best to maximize those slots before going for other cards.

• If you live near a SW hub and plan on mostly flying domestic, then go for an SW card instead of the United and/or Amex SPG.

• If you are primarily planning aspiration travel, then the Hyatt is a great card to target. 2 free nights with no restrictions and it's the best when planning as a couple because you can stack it into 4 nights + any amount of UR points to make up the difference. During my stay at the Park Hyatt Tokyo I ran into a few couples who stacked this exact bonus into their honeymoon. Some had gotten the Ritz-Carlton for their Kyoto and Osaka stays. It would have been fun if I was a mod then. You won't be rejected under 5/24 yet, but Chase can change this at any time.

• CS(R) travel redemption through the travel portal will often provide greater value than the transfer partners because 1 UR = 1.5 cents per point for all travel. It's a great floor for dirt cheap flights and/or you have no recourse for dates/no award availability. You will also earn miles for that related airline because UR will show up as cash in their system. Southwest does not show up in the Chase online travel portal, but you can call to book.

• Keep in mind that this hobby changes regularly, sometimes for the better and sometimes for the worse. Stay up to date on the news, keep on top of your cash flow, and ideally earn/burn points quickly.

Edit: Thanks for the gold kind stranger :)

https://thepointsguy.com/news/significant-changes-confirmed-for-chases-sapphire-reserve-card/

tl;dr - annual fee increasing from $450 to $550, all card holders will get Lyft Pink access (15% discount on rides and scooter rentals) for 1 year, 10x points on lyft rides, $60 doordash credit for 2 years, doordash pass ($120 value) for 1 year

last updated: 10/4/2017

WARNING Applying for "too many" Chase cards "too soon" may lead to a shutdown of your Chase portfolio. Almost every DP of these case show that this specific type of shutdown can be overruled by making your case.

Note: The intended target audience of this guide are newbies who want to optimize Chase cards and are under 5/24. This guide does not cover folks beyond 5/24 neither does it fit those who are under 5/24 yet chose to altogether neglect Chase cards.

Introduction

I answer a lot of question in r/churning newbie thread and lately I’ve noticed that there is one question that I end up answering multiple times every day…and well it is getting a bit repetitive. Plus, I think to fully answer the said question, one really has to take a lot of time and effort. This is my attempt to answer that question to the best of my ability in as comprehensive manner as I can. This way I don’t have to engage in an hour long conversation on this subject over and over again. Don’t get me wrong, I love helping out newbies -otherwise I wouldn't be in a newbie thread answering questions or here writing this guide. That said, here is the question in hand:

I am 0/24, 1/24, 2/24, 3/24, or 4/24, what card(s) should I get next?

But in order to get to the heart of this question, I expect you to know certain things before hand, let’s call them “prerequisites”. In prerequisites section I will briefly go over things that I expect you to know and provide some follow up links that you may want to check out.

Then I will consider various scenearious and answer the question in hand. I intend to update this guide time and again (last updated 1/19/2017) so whatever you see here is most likely up-to-date information. This is out of necessity because, for example, 4 weeks ago CSR would have been the first card I would have recommended but now I would recommend Ink Plus (more on this later).

Finally, after tackling the question from various angles, I will end this guide by answering some Frequently Asked Questions (FAQs). These questions will mostly be based on questions that I have seen a lot in newbie question thread of r/churning.

Prerequisites

What is 5/24?

If the credit bureau Chase pulls for you shows 5 or more cards open in last 24 months, then Chase will generally deny you certain cards.

Supplementary Reading:

5/24 on r/churning Wiki
5/24 Rule Explained – DoC
What Credit Bureau does Chase Pull? – DoC

Free ways to check credit report?

Experian phone app for Experian and Credit Karma for Transunion and Equifax are two most common methods.

What is 1/30, 2/30, 24 Month Denial, and 1/24 Sapphire Family Rule ?

Please consult my guide Anti-Churning Rules.

What is Chase reconsideration (recon in short) number?

Personal: 1-888-270-2127 (8AM-10PM EST on weekdays, 8AM-8PM EST on weekend)

Business: 800-453-9719 (1PM-10PM EST on weekdays)

Check Status: 888-338-2586 (24/7 bot) or

Quick Status Check: 800-432-3117, press #,3,1 then enter Social Security Number (SSN).

Remember you can only recon within 30 days from the day you submitted your application.

Supplementary Reading:

Credit Card Reconsideration Numbers – DoC

Should I recon or not?

Generally speaking recon for personal Chase credit card is rather easy. On the contrary, it is strongly advised that you don't recon for Chase business applications, particularly if your business is a "business". The reason being that Chase business recon is considered to be harsh in a sense that they'll ask you a ton of question about your business. Because of this the general advice for a newbie is never recon Chase business card. However, do note that sometimes Chase will ask you to call them and occasionally this request from Chase may only be because they wish to do some verification. Still, because you've no way of knowing if it is simple verification call or not, I strongly advice newbies against reconing for Chase business card. Now if on a rather rare occasion Chase sends you a letter stating you must call then do proceed to call.

How to combine hard pulls?

If you apply for 2 Chase personal cards on the same day then your pulls are combined. In other words, your credit bureau will show 1 hard inquiry from Chase instead of 2. Note that should you get approved for both cards, then both new cards will still show up in your report.

Supplement Reading:

Card Issuers that Combine Pulls – Doc

Does Ink Count Towards 5/24?

As of writing this article, there is a huge misconception (which probably prevails in above supplement articles) that Ink products do count towards 5/24. Most who argue this do so because they believe Chase can “see” your Ink card. However, important thing to note is that Ink products (like many business cards) do not show up in your personal credit report. As such, Ink products do not count towards 5/24 but remember 5/24 does apply to them.

Supplement Reading:

Which Business Cards Report – DoC

2 cards at 4/24 trick???

Suppose you are at 4/24 and decide to apply for 2 personal chase cards on the same day. One would think that one of the apps would get approved while other would be denied because of 5/24. However, recent data points (DP) suggest that it is possible to get approved for both. I think the ideal thing to do is –

• apply for the card that you want more first

• get it approved, recon if you must (remember recon isn’t open 24/7)

• then apply for second card on the same day

• and i would further say recon to get that one approved as well

NOTE: There have been successful DPs of grabbing 3 5/24 cards at 4/24. However, it is possible that you might run into a blockade due to 2/30 or 1/30 rule.

2 Sapphire Product in a day???

It is possible to get both CSR and CSP by applying for them both on the same day. Obviously 5/24 applies.

How do I get a business card without an actual business?

Have you ever sold an item on amazon/ebay? Have you tutored kids for money? Have you been paid (in cookies) for babysitting your brother? Congrats, you got a “business”. Essentially during the application process all you have to do is the following:

1. select “sole proprietor” as business type

2. use your SSN for tax ID number (TIN)

3. and use your name as business name

Yes, this is a perfectly valid thing to do, even if you’re applying at branch. It always helps if you’ve been doing “business” for couple of years and showing couple of thousand as annual revenue is generally helpful as well. Remember, these cards are approved based on your personal record.

The ABSOLUTE WORST Case of Manufactured Spend (MS) aka I don’t have enough spend, should I even apply for CSR/Ink/CSP/etc?

The bonus in these cards is so high that even in worst case scenario, you’ll end up making $500 from couch. I describe the absolute worst case scenario as follows:

• you can’t put any organic spend (aka your real spend) on the card

• instead you’ll MS all your minimum spend

• and you will MS by paying highest fee you possibly could – 3% with Venmo or Square Cash

• lastly you will burn your Ultimate Reward (UR) points at one of its lowest value 1:1 cash i.e. 100 points is $1.

Now, for an example let me consider my beloved Ink Plus. Ink Plus has a signup bonus of 70k (more on that later) and it comes with an AF of $95. If you MS all $5k with Venmo then your worst net profit will be $505.

700-95 (fee) – 150 (Venmo fee) + 50 (1% earning) = $505

Congratulations, you made $505 by clicking buttons for less than 5 minutes.

Now imagine if you could put all organic spend or even half organic spend. How about if you could MS at lower fee rate? What if you could get 2 cents per point (cpp) with UR points?

Small Note on Venmo: If you use a credit card (3% fee) to send money to Account2 from Account1, then don't send that Venmo balance right back (no fee) from Account2 to Account1. This will eventually lead to a shutdown. Ideally speaking, you want to send money to a trustworthy person, have him transfer Venmo balance to their bank account, and then this person should return you your money via other means such as cash or check.

Supplementary Reading:

MS techniques that still work by frequentmiler
MS subforum at Flyertalk

Do I burn 5/24 slot on UR earning card or non-UR like Marriott, United, or Southwest?

UR transfer to Marriott, United, Southwest, and more 1:1 so unless you’ve a special situation in hand, focus on top UR cards first. Additionally, UR points can be cashed out 1:1, redeemed via UR travel portal at 1.25-1.5 cpp. Last but not least, for most of us UR cards are long term investments. The amount of points you can shower by having Ink, CSR, and Freedom cards is unfathomable.

Supplement Reading:

The Ultimate Womo Combo – me
[Different Ways to Use UR – r/churning wiki] (https://www.reddit.com/r/churning/comments/3i1kdl/faq_different_ways_to_use_chase_ultimate_rewards/)

I am 3/24, want a companion pass as well as UR earning card(s), what should I do?

If a Companion Pass is of high value to you then it makes sense to ditch the idea of applying for CSP and CSR and burn 2 slots of 5/24 towards attaining a companion pass. However, an important thing to remember is that Ink products do not count towards 5/24. Because of this, if time allows, I suggest grabbing Ink product(s) before applying for SW cards.

Supplement Reading:

CP Megathread – r/churning

I desperately want non-UR card(s) that are under 5/24 but I don’t want to lose out on UR earning personal card either….what should I do?

You could get that card non-UR card and then visit a Chase branch to see if you’re pre-approved for a UR earning card. As of now, nobody knows what triggers pre-approval but it seems like 95% of folks who have had pre-approval didn’t have 2+ Chase cards in last 6 months. Remember that most non-UR cards can’t be applied in branch.

Supplement Reading:

Bypass 5/24 – DoC

MY Recommended way of Prioritizing UR earning Cards (last updated 2/12/2017)

A little bit of disclaimer in hand – everything in this section assumes the following:

• You don’t have a special circumstance preventing you on focusing on UR cards only

• You have fair amount of time to focus on UR cards only

• You’ve at least 2 slots left in 5/24 i.e. at worst you are 3/24

That said here is the specific order in which I would prioritize my application towards UR earning cards:

Ink Preferred (IP) is #1

I rank it #1 pretty much because

• 1st year AF is waived for in branch applicants

• Chase does not report opening of a business account to a your personal credit bureau

• Chase business cards do not count towards 5/24

• most importantly, the current sign up bonus of 80k is a limited time offer that could technically disappear tomorrow without warning.

• but 100k offer is available through Business Relation Manager (BRM)

• last but not least paper/fax application through BRM by-passes 5/24

edit [2/25]: Looks like targeted 100k offer will be available for in branch applicants.

Chase Sapphire Reserve (CSR) is #2

Current online sign-up bonus on this card is mere 50k but do note that you can double dip the $300 travel credit. Once you get charged with 2nd year AF, you'll have 30 days till you can get a full refund and in that period you can consume your $300 credit.

• On May 2017, Chase changed travel credit from calendar year to cardmember year. In other words it is no longer possible to triple dip the $300 credit.

• On Sep 2017, referrals were added for CSR

https://www.reddit.com/r/churning/wiki/ccreferrals

Reminder: Applying for CSR and CSP on the same day will bypass 1/24 Sapphire Rule and also get your inquires combined. It is recommended that you don't do this at 3/24.

Supplementary Reading:

Comprehensive list of what counts towards travel credit – FT

Chase Sapphire Preferred (CSP) is #2

The current offer is the standard 55 offer (5k from adding an authorized user). Chase Private Client (CPC) can get in branch 65k offer (5k from adding an authorized user) While this is a card everyone should apply for, it just so happens that currently above two cards should often be prioritized first. If you wish to sign up for this card then consider signing it up through the referral link below and win some internet <3

https://www.reddit.com/r/churning/wiki/ccreferrals

Reminder: Applying for CSR and CSP on the same day will bypass 1/24 Sapphire Rule and also get your inquires combined. It is recommended that you don't do this at 3/24.

FAQs

Should one always follow above ranking?

Not necessarily. Above ranking is often ideal for those who have enough time to space out business space out business applications.

Why Rank CSR and CSP at #2?

Since introduction of "1/24 Sapphire Product" rule, IMO CSR and CSP have become a matter of preference. If you want higher signup value then CSR is the one to go with.

Why didn’t Freedom card make the cut? $150 for $500 spend is real easy man.

Because the signup bonus often isn’t good enough. Even with increased 32k signup bonus in branch (credit: USCCG), the math is heavily in favor of above cards. That’s right, even if you put organic spend on Freedom and MS on Ink+ in absolute worst way, even then Ink+ will be in heavy lead.

Ideally speaking Freedom cards are what you downgrade to not what you start with.

My score is low, should I start with Freedom?

If your score is piss poor then have someone with decent score add you as AU (they can keep your card if they like). Alternatively, it might be worth getting a store card that reports to credit bureau. Why? Because over recon, Chase will not count store cards for 5/24.

If your score is kinda okay then I suggest you start with CSP. The minimum initial credit limit Chase has to extend you for CSP is 5k as well so you might as well try. If they deny you, you can always make a case over recon. If they still deny you after 20 recon attempts, make peace knowing the fact that you attempted to go the most optimal route. If you’ve a decent score then I suggest attempting CSR (minimum initial credit limit of 10k needed)ko first for above mentioned reasons.

I’m under 5/24 and just received great targeted Amex offer, what should I do?

The important thing to realize is as follows:

• Most folks can easily get 2 Chase cards in a month.

• Amex reports opening of a new card on 2nd statement.

In essence, it is often possible for you to apply for your Amex card and burn through 5/24 Chase cards before Amex cards shows up in your report. However, proceed at your own risk.

I must apply for XYZ non-chase personal card soon, I’ve already applied for 2 Chase cards this month, I’m still under 5/24, I want to get a third 5/24 Chase card, but XYZ card will put me over 5/24. What do I do?

You could attempt to get around this situation by dropping a 3rd Chase app some days after your 1st Chase app. Then apply for the XYZ card. Now should you get denied for for your 3rd Chase app, you can call recon within 30 days for reconsideration. For example, if you were denied because of 2/30, then wait until you are out of 2/30 zone and call but remember to call within 30 days of your 3rd application.

I am at 4/24, how do I get maximum # of cards that are under 5/24?

• Remember that Ink products (IC and IP) do not count towards 5/24 nor does the Southsest Business card. You could get these cards before jumping on 5/24 personal cards.

• Attempt to grab 2 (or more) personal 5/24 cards on the same day. See prerequisites section for detail.

TPG: He is tall. He will look over you, unless you have cocaine. He has his best interest at heart. He has the banks back. He makes a lot of money.

Dan’s Deals: You will have to wade through 237 articles on buying strollers for $87 to find an article related to churning. Oh, and he through out the first pitch of some baseball game.

Doctor of Credit: He actually gives credit to his sources, what a fool. Also, he will tell you how to get free food. Free food.

One Mile at a Time: He likes weird planes that fly to odd places as long as he sits in the front. He has been spotted with a camera crew following him. He does not complain about champagne as much as TPG, but has still complained.

View from the Wing: Gary actually reads airline financial documents while sitting on his high horse overlooking you, a mere peon. He even writes about said documents, sometimes in an interesting way. He does comment on quality of champagne.

Million Mile Secrets: They only post ~once per day. That means less fluffy mindless dribble than many blogs. They recently wrote an article on repositioning cruises. I didn’t read it.

Seat 31B: This guy actually flies in coach. This guy does not tell you about the quality of champagne. This guy rarely blogs anymore, but he still knows two shakes about award travel.

The Frequent Miler: Another soulless blog that spews the same information as most other blogs. They have an edgy green color scheme instead of the industry normal blue.

Rene’s Points: Rene likes Delta. Delta doesn’t fly to my airport. Reading Rene’s Points reminds me I have 700k Delta miles that will never expire.

Loyalty Lobby: They have a compensation clinic. They like to complain and get stuff for free. They will even complain for you if you are too lazy to complain yourself. This sub likes free things, I think everyone here will complain for themselves.

God Save the Points: This blog has an outdated reasonably correct article on ANA ATW rules. That is all you need to know about this blog.

Wandering Aramean: I thought for years this blog was Wandering Armenian. That is not the name. Aram is in Syria not Armenia. Sometimes they have unique oddball articles that are interesting. Much of the time it is a regurgitation of every other blog.

Head for Points: You must read this blog out loud with a British accent. It is really worthless if you are in the US since you can’t get UK cards in the US unless you are British, then you don’t need to try to read the blog with a British accent.

Danny the Deal Guru: Danny wants to be Dan when he grows up.

The Man in Seat 61: There aren’t 61 rows on most planes. This is a blog about trains. Trains aren’t planes. They don’t even shill the Amtrak credit card. Not a true churners blog without shilling.

The MileLion: I don’t live in Singapore. The MileLion lives in Singapore. They write about credit cards I can’t get. They write about Asia travel news before TPG hears about it and sends his staff to turn the news into a reason my to apply for an Amex Platinum.

Points with a Crew: No promotion is good enough. Everything is a massive devaluation. They post once or twice a week. Sometimes it is worth reading. Often not.

My son woke up from his nap. I am done. This only scratched the surface of the Churning Blogs out there.