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u/AostaValley Mar 23 '25
5000 year ago.
Picture of Vessel from 19th century.
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u/NyPoster Mar 23 '25
The simplicity of this kind of mistake is why there are people who think we lived with dinosaurs.
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Mar 23 '25
Also the Flintstones
Although the Flintstones may take place in the very distant future...
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u/onward_upward_tt Mar 23 '25 •
Seriously. It's funny, there are people ITT annoyed that people came to the comments to correct the figure given here but personally, I feel as though (I imagine you do as well) even hinting that ships like that existed 5000 years ago shows a pretty egregious ignorance of history that, in the wrong person, can be truly detrimental to their understanding of the world around them. Sure, "ackshually," people are annoying but this one is pretty bad and worth correcting in my opinion lol.
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u/NyPoster Mar 23 '25
Yah totally, especially since the point of the post is suggesting that we're moving backwards in time, So ... passage of time is the joke. It's reasonable to be like ... woah this s*** is wrong. Hyperbole is funny ... but this is so specific it seems like an error and not hyperbole for humors sake. Even the smaller number (a factor of 10) would've been funny
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u/Slow-Goat-2460 Mar 23 '25
The invention of the keel is only a little more than 2000 years old
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u/ToughManufacturer343 Mar 23 '25
I think there is a point where people who aren’t particularly informed just lump all technology and events into a category called “a really long time ago” which constitutes anything older than the 20th century
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u/exitpursuedbybear Mar 23 '25
And the kite pulling a ship is not the same way sails work. Sails work like wings on planes using differences in pressure on the two sides to move the ship which is why sailing ships can do things like sail upwind and so on which would be impossible for a kite dragging a ship.
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u/Gr0ggy1 Mar 23 '25
Controllable, steerable kites are absolutely able to pull a vessel upwind.
Check out instructional kite surfing videos to learn how for yourself. They tack through about 55-60° vs the 40-45° of a Bermuda style sail, but easily matching a square rigged vessel.
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u/hitbythebus Mar 23 '25
You also don’t have the overhead of carrying big heavy masts, and when the kite is pulled in there is no additional drag. Advances in materials technologies mean the kite is also lighter than the old sails of comparable size.
I feel like this whole post would be like crapping on the automotive industry for exclusivity using geared transmissions when DaVinci had already invented the CVT. The idea and examples existed, but with modern materials technology they can be more viable and certainly bear revisiting.
We also didn’t know the environment impact of switching to petroleum powered propulsion when we transitioned to it from sails. It wouldn’t be insane to use that knowledge to impact our decisions going forward.
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u/TheNameOfMyBanned Mar 23 '25
All that is old, is new again.
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Mar 23 '25 edited Mar 23 '25
As a mechanic i always tell people we should've never left horses behind.
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u/ActlvelyLurklng Mar 23 '25
Horses were unarguably, screwed over by wolves/dogs. Like they worked for us, pulled our carts and buggies, plowed our fields, carried us on their back during war (literally we rode them) only for us to turn around be like. "Nah dogs our best friend now."
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Mar 23 '25 edited Mar 23 '25
To be fair the Native Americans did the opposite at one point. They used dogs for eveything pulling carts and all then horses showed up and they were like oh screw them these are way better.
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u/Devilslettuceadvocte Mar 23 '25
Well dogs were domesticated 4000 years before any other animal ( dogs domesticated around 15,000 years ago and livestock around 11,000) with the evidence available.
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Mar 23 '25
We call dogs “man’s best friend” because they were the first animal to be domesticated and helped us hunt in a time where that was the main survival method.
So we didn’t leave horses behind, dogs were here first and helped greatly.
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u/theslootmary Mar 23 '25
Dogs were always closer to us tbf. They lived inside with us whereas horses didn’t. Also, we domesticated dogs way earlier than horses.
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Mar 23 '25
only for us to turn around be like.
"You know what? Dear horse, you don't taste that bad after all. You are promoted to dinner"
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Mar 23 '25
The entire country would be smothered in horse shit with our current population
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u/100YearsWaiting2Shit Mar 23 '25
So would an alternate universe where we still heavily relied on horses be called horsepunk?
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u/shivilization_7 Mar 23 '25
And have some crooked blacksmith try to sell me reshoeing after only 100 miles just because I’m a woman? No thanks!
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u/georgetds Mar 23 '25
I am increasingly of the opinion that we have all made a big mistake in coming down from the trees in the first place. And some people have said that even the trees had been a bad move, and that no one should ever have left the oceans. (I am paraphrasing Douglas Adams. It is amazing how much I find myself quoting, to at least attempting to quote, Hitchhikers Guide or Dirk Gently over the years.)
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u/OriginalNord Mar 23 '25
Just like that BNL song
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u/Utsider Mar 23 '25
I am unfamiliar. Is it an old song that is relevant again?
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u/OriginalNord Mar 23 '25
Nah they have a song called everything old is new again
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u/XDracam Mar 23 '25
Techbros tired of reinventing the train so they're reinventing the sailboat now
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u/BlazingKush Mar 23 '25
That's actually not a bad one, since nowadays boats are usually made from metals.
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u/squngy Mar 23 '25
Metal vs wood is not the issue, the ships are simply many times larger and the idea of waiting for a good wind is not acceptable any more.
Kites are better than sails, because they can go a lot higher up where winds are stronger and more constant.
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u/RethoricalBrush Mar 23 '25
This idea was first implemented around 15 years ago(?) and it works, however one of the problems is that modern freighters crew is around 20 people (cost cutting) and there are many things that could go wrong with this (maintenance and repairs, mostly) so nobody really gave it a chance.
Source: I work in maritime
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u/larrybirdismygoat Mar 23 '25
Can’t larger ships also hoist more sails?
I am sure there would be a market for slow paced but lower cost delivery as well.
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u/squngy Mar 23 '25
They can, but they aren't just longer, they are also taller, so the increase in deck area is not proportional to the increase in size.
You also can't just keep adding sails without them blocking the wind from each other.
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u/K1nt4tsU Mar 23 '25
The other thing is, you can get a lot more surface area-per-anchor point with a kite on a winch than a sail on a mast, and also masts take up space that would force them to rearrange shipping containers, and make it harder to maneuver a crane around for loading/unloading.
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u/sentence-interruptio Mar 23 '25
indeed, remake of the classics can be great.
Even Newton remade classic Greek science and modernized it.
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u/Grand_Protector_Dark Mar 23 '25
This isn't tech bro nonsense.
Using kites/wind for modern ships is a legitimate avenue for reducing fuel usage.
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u/fuckmywetsocks Mar 23 '25
Reinventing the train aka pods that move like 4 people.
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Mar 23 '25
[removed] — view removed comment
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u/The_Countess Mar 23 '25 edited Mar 23 '25
Exactly, a ship like that is more like 300 years ago at best, possibly just 200.
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u/BigoteMexicano Mar 23 '25
5000 years ago was the bronze age. Ships back then were just big rafts. But they probably had sails of some sort too.
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u/Neoliberal_Nightmare Mar 23 '25
Bronze age ships got pretty big. The bronze age collapse lost so much and set civilisation back a while.
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u/BigoteMexicano Mar 23 '25
They were big, yes. There was a whole ass naval trade network. But they didn't have nails yet. Their ships couldn't have been nearly as big as the one in the meme
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u/Neoliberal_Nightmare Mar 23 '25
Clippers aren't actually that big without the excessive sails, larger bronze age ships may have reached it. There's ways to make large wooden structures without nails.
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u/CleaveIshallnot Mar 23 '25
But those bronze sales always seemed to cause problems tho.
Except for bonfire festival time of the year, then they were huge hit .
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u/Matinee_Lightning Mar 23 '25
*500 years ago. Sailing is really old, but those kinds of sails weren't invented until way later
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u/Trainman1351 Mar 23 '25
Not even 500 years ago. That appears to be a clipper ship, which I believe was built for fast cross-Pacific trade in the mid-1800s.
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u/bagelwithclocks Mar 23 '25
Pretty much the last generation of cargo sailing ships.
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u/Stripedpussy Mar 23 '25
And one of those smaller clipper ships had almost 2x the amount of crew that one of those container ship uses.
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u/MercantileReptile Mar 23 '25
And a fraction of the space, unlike the gajillion containers that would fit on a modern one.
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u/juancarv Mar 23 '25
Ancient Egypt and Mesopotamia used the sail around 7500 years ago. The principle is the same, regardless of the improvements added, and that's the point of the meme.
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u/No-Lunch4249 Mar 23 '25 edited Mar 23 '25
I think we all understood the meme, they're just saying that the particular kind of sailing ship in the bottom frame was quite late in the technological development of sailing ships
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Mar 23 '25
Your comment is purposely obtuse for the sake of being argumentative. That's like showing a car and a horse pulled cart and saying "the principle is the same, regardless of the improvements added".
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u/fllr Mar 23 '25
Oh... Then go back 2000 years and navigate the Atlantic, since the principle is the same. Should be easy.
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u/damndirtyape Mar 23 '25
Ancient Egypt and Mesopotamia used the sail around 7500 years ago.
I'm not sure if you're kidding. In case you aren't, they definitely were not sailing around 7,500 years ago. That's the stone age. They had things like simple crafts made of reeds for river travel. They certainly didn't have sailboats.
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u/External-Goal-3948 Mar 23 '25
Somebody recently watched moana 2.
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u/Protahgonist Mar 23 '25
Terrible movie, right!? I was so disappointed, after loving the first one. I thought the plot and everything in 2 were good ideas, but the music ruins it for me. It is NOT the same sort of vibe, that's for sure. RIP Lin Manuel Miranda.
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u/jgzman Mar 23 '25
RIP Lin Manuel Miranda.
He's not dead, mate, he's just busy.
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u/External-Goal-3948 Mar 23 '25
He was never asked. Apparently, moana 2 was supposed to be a tv series, but they decided to make it a movie.
I agree that the movie was awful, just awful.
Let's go sailing. Oh, let's find a new place to sail. Oh, there's Maui. Hey, he kinda pulled up the island. Oh, there's the coconut people. Oh, there's a clam and a sea vampire. Oh, there's another way. Here's some crappy songs. The movie is over.
It's like the confused Jackie chan meme.
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u/Kaffe-Mumriken Mar 23 '25
Apparently it was at first meant to be a Tv show but put together to a full length, that’s why the pacing feels weird also
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u/Bearwynn Mar 23 '25
Certified "straight to home video" style Disney movie yet somehow they scammed me out of a cinema ticket amount of money for it
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u/See_Bee10 Mar 23 '25
This is a really great technology. It can be retrofitted onto an existing ship and has the potential to reduce millions of tons of carbon per year.
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u/SomewhereNo8378 Mar 23 '25
Yeah not sure what the whole outrage is here.
Just because ships with sails existed means this new version is dumb somehow?
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u/arfelo1 Mar 23 '25
You don't understand. I need to feel superior for comparing a modern boat with a kite to an old sailboat.
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u/Pen_Front Mar 23 '25
It's mostly a joke, but there's also the misunderstanding of technical progress being a line and things that were used but aren't being obsolete.
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u/DoubleDoube Mar 23 '25 edited Mar 24 '25
My understanding is that it’s not equivalent to sails either because it actually goes (much) higher which can help it catch stronger winds.
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u/wanklez Mar 23 '25
The deployment and retraction of these kites is the reason we haven't seen them deployed yet. Anyone who kiteboards is aware of how difficult launch and land are with little kites, the problem becomes much greater at this enormous size and from a moving vessel.
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u/jmouw88 Mar 24 '25
Is it?
I don't think it a bad idea, but I have not yet seen any details on the cost, longevity, manpower, space, maintenance, or any other requirements.
Many of these ideas sound nice, but the economics often don't work out. I have not yet heard any shipowners talking about fitting these systems yet, and I follow that space quite closely. Many are spending millions on sulfur scrubbers and dual fuel ships.
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u/sassafrassaclassa Mar 23 '25
If y'all really can't comprehend that the kite is meant to assist the engine...... Well gee golly gum drops I wish you the best out there.
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u/All-Seeing_Hands Mar 23 '25
What do you mean a parachute can’t pull a cargo ship by itself?
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u/jrak193 Mar 23 '25
It's just meant to reduce the amount of fuel used by taking advantage of the wind, even if just a little bit. I'm not saying it's a good idea or a bad idea. Like everyone else in this comment section, I'm not qualified to give my opinion on the matter.
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u/piratecheese13 Mar 23 '25 edited Mar 23 '25
Winds in the upper atmosphere altitudes are a lot stronger
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u/arfelo1 Mar 23 '25
I mean, this is a great idea, but those kites definitely don't reach the upper atmosphere
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u/AuroraAriia Mar 23 '25
Ah yes, the ancient art of flying ships! We’re basically reinventing the wheel... with a kite!
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u/Lord_Snaps Mar 23 '25
Its like that republican who said the US should close all libraries, because if people wanted a book they could just buy it. When then confronted about not everybody can afford to buy books. He suggested there could be a place where poor people can borrow the books for free.
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u/K2O3_Portugal Mar 23 '25
I hope I'm still alive when they reinvent the combustion engine 🤣🤣🤣
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u/LayeredHalo3851 Mar 23 '25
"It turns out that explosions could propel vehicles" - News article in 3025
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u/Sgt-Spliff- Mar 23 '25
I get why this looks funny but legit we should look back on pre-industrial tech to see what we could incorporate into our lives. There's probably a lot that wouldn't be so bad but also has no carbon footprint. At least looking at it for inspiration for future tech
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u/karlnite Mar 23 '25
It’s all well and good, but that old ship is the peak of engineering for only 150-200 years ago. Like they started extracting oil around the same time it was in service. It could still be sailing today.
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u/Hydra_Master Mar 23 '25
This might actually be a decent advancement for sails. I'd think a broken cable (the "kite string") is easier and quicker to replace that a mast, especially in the middle of the ocean.
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u/Matyaslike Mar 23 '25
Welcome to sailing 2 the game. Sailing 3 hopefully will be done with sunsails in space! Can't wait for it!
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u/Sad_Mall_3349 Mar 23 '25
I think kites in various configs are already being used (again) to support ICE engines on freighters.
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u/UniversalBasicIdiot Mar 23 '25
Lol, 5000 years? Maybe like 500. Generously, 1000. But that sort of ship was also peak technology about 200 years ago, too.
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Mar 23 '25
oh shit they're right, this is genius. I wonder how they found out about such a good way to reduce carbon emissions
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u/TheDrturtles Mar 23 '25
This week on tech bros invent things that already exist
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u/Godess_Ilias Mar 23 '25
i doubt that sailing is 5000 years old , maybe 3000 at most
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u/Beaujardin Mar 23 '25
Wrong this is genuilely good. Wind is stronger up there, and later they may add more kite to save even more on fuel. Eventually the system will be fully automated so that ship will use first of all renouvable direct energies like wind and solar and only when not possible (clouds, night, no wind) "stored" energy such as fossil ones. This should have been done already long ago but in marine people are extremely stupid, stubborn and greedy.
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u/unknownuser105 Mar 23 '25
500 years ago maybe.
5000 was the time of Mesopotamia, Egypt, The Indus Valley, and China figuring out agriculture, and establishing the first cities.
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u/MalkavTepes Mar 23 '25
This has been around for a few years already. Kites as opposed to sails are supposed to capture air currents at higher altitudes which are much stronger than the air currents at sea level.
It is funny that we're just now realizing we could combine old and new technologies to get more efficiency out of our current methods...
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u/NerfPup Mar 23 '25
That's like 300-400 years ago boats looked completely different 5000 years ago 😭
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u/OutlawQuill Mar 23 '25
OP 5000 years ago was when writing and the first cities appeared. Sailing ships like that have existed wayyy earlier than that. In fact, have you heard of a sailboat by any chance?
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u/FilmjolkFilmjolk Mar 23 '25
so for those who don\t know, the kites would be a lot more efficient than standard sails, mainly because they reach higher altitudes and stronger wind currents.
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u/shoopin_day Mar 23 '25
I read it saying “giant kitties” and got so excited for extremely large kittens traversing the ocean pulling boats 😔
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u/Ralexcraft Mar 23 '25
Actually much better assuming there is wind.
The ropes can hold much bigger sails than whatever a mast could, and it’d be more feasible than sails large enough to make a different on a cargo ship. Plus bridges are not an issue with that.
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u/gareththegeek Mar 23 '25
Also kites are only going to pull in the direction of the wind, whereas sails are capable of sailing into the wind by tacking. So it's actually even more stupid than it first appears
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Mar 24 '25
Sounds like a good idea to me. That’s gas you don’t gotta buy. Have an engine. Only use it when you need it. Coast across the salt on windy wings. Burn the black bones when you travel opposite such beings.
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u/aaron_adams Mar 24 '25
We've now come in a full circle. Next thing you'll know, they'll talk about burning coal to make shipping quicker again.
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u/vatreides411 Mar 23 '25
Ya, but do you want your ebay order to be totally dependent on the wind?
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Mar 23 '25
It would supplement the existing engines of the ship, not replace them. They would still get there in the same amount of time since the engines would compensate any time the wind isn’t helping.
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u/2730Ceramics Mar 23 '25
If you look at this and say "ah yes, kites are the same thing as sails" then you really need to go back to high school.
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Mar 23 '25
The problem is using the wind to go where you want when you want to.
Don’t hear much about “seasonal trade winds” anymore.
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u/27803 Mar 23 '25
I mean that’s more like 150 years ago but yea imagine that using free energy amazing
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u/Heimdallrr89 Mar 23 '25
Just because we found something “new” that doesn’t mean we can use old tech in addition for maximal benefits.
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u/Outrageous_Olive_489 Mar 23 '25
5000 year ago?!? A bit too much. More like 500.
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u/pastuluchu Mar 23 '25
Saves you your biggest expense which is gas money, why not. That logic always seems to be missing from these articles.
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u/i_heart_pasta Mar 23 '25
The response when you point this out: “Oh no dude, totally different, trust me”
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u/AlcoholPrep Mar 23 '25
200 years ago, yes. 5000 years ago, no.
However novel means of using wind power may well be worth considering. I don't know whether a giant kite would be feasible, but it may be worth an experiment.
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Mar 23 '25
Soon may the Wellerman come to bring us sugar and tea and rum.
One day when the tugging is done we’ll take our leave and go
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u/gentle_pirate23 Mar 23 '25
All of the discussions in this thread are rather pointless, while carbon emissions are no joke, I really think the justice system around the world needs to take a firm stance against abuzive exploitation of natural resources.
Deforestations, bleaching, etc, much bigger impacts than car, boat or plane emissions.
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u/hdmghsn Mar 23 '25
Hear me out what if you used some sort of oar and used physical strength to move the boat
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u/DarkWolfL91986 Mar 23 '25
timer is money, and thast would slow things down and take to long, no dice, make hydrogen powered engines, not this caveman tech
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u/pipe2489 Mar 23 '25
You need an extremely large kite to make any sort of difference. Not only that but the cables required for the kite need to be strong enough to handle the pull of the kite. Additionally you would also need a mechanism that can launch the kite high enough in the air to open and grab onto a wind current. Not that practical if you think about it.
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u/Suitable-Formal4072 Mar 23 '25
look bro. all we need is some good seed money. trust me this is a winner. it's gonna be a disruptor
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u/capilot Mar 23 '25
I worked with someone who was working with someone who was doing this. This was all about a decade ago.
The idea is you build the kite thing into a shipping container and mount that shipping container at the front of the ship. When the wind is behind you, you deploy the kite. It doesn't replace the big engines, but the small improvement in fuel efficiency justifies the cost.
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u/Thorolhugil Mar 23 '25
Meme aside, what this is referring to is actually massive retractable sails for cargo ships that not only reduce emissions but cut fuel usage (cargo ships use a fucktonne of fuel) by 20%.
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u/edward414 Mar 23 '25
They figured out a way to sail without paying fifty men with rum and scurvy.