r/GlobalOffensive • u/Chuckys2 Match Thread Team • Jul 17 '17
Discussion | Esports mousesports vs FaZe Clan / PGL Major Kraków 2017 - Round 2 / Post-Match Discussion
mousesports 1-0 FaZe Clan
Train: 19-15
mousesports | Liquipedia | Official Site | Twitter | Facebook | Youtube
FaZe Clan | Liquipedia | Official Site | Twitter | Facebook | Youtube
PGL Major Kraków 2017 - Information, Schedule & Discussion
For VoDs of this game check out /r/CSeventVODs
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Who was the MVP for this map? (POLL)
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MAP: Train
| Team | T | CT | OT1CT:T | Total |
|---|---|---|---|---|
| mouz | 8 | 7 | 3:1 | 19 |
| CT | T | OT1^T:CT | ||
| FaZe | 7 | 8 | 0:0 | 15 |
| mouz | K | A | D |
|---|---|---|---|
| loWel | 27 | 3 | 21 |
| denis | 26 | 4 | 21 |
| oskar | 26 | 2 | 20 |
| ropz | 24 | 2 | 17 |
| chrisJ | 21 | 3 | 25 |
| FaZe | |||
| rain | 33 | 5 | 23 |
| allu | 25 | 5 | 26 |
| NiKo | 24 | 4 | 25 |
| karrigan | 12 | 3 | 27 |
| kioShiMa | 10 | 2 | 23 |
Map Detailed Stats
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Jul 17 '17
kill me
Kioshima really needs to stop fucking around. He's been absolutely terrible both games
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u/DesHis 5 years coin Jul 17 '17 edited Jun 19 '25
towering oil offer steep shaggy grey tidy historical axiomatic simplistic
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u/rsmuss Jul 17 '17
He is having an off tournament. he has been doing good in fazes previous tournaments. Its not like niko is at his best level at the moment either.
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u/Dr_Tchock Jul 17 '17
Karrigan playing 9387468 Dimensional checkers and saving his strats for the Gamer's Paradise major 2019
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Jul 17 '17
gamers paradise major 2019
gonna be $70,000,000 tournament with all the highest tech for pcs and everyone has to use vr to play, and tournament money is not guarenteed.
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u/Frostvind howl Jul 17 '17
Nah, tech will be so good, they'll be playing it in a simulated zone like the hunger games
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u/madrarua87 BIG Jul 17 '17
Faze gets Penta.... Faze loses to Penta....Faze will got eliminatet by every german in the tournament.
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u/AndyFNG MOUZ Jul 17 '17
Niko would never recover from the tilt of being eliminated by all the Germans.
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u/HijoDelUrysohn King NiKo Jul 17 '17
It's so frustrating to see NiKo stuck in this shitty team. Let's hope a good org like Mouz picks him up at some point.
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u/Le_Tennant MOUZ Jul 17 '17
Yeah the meme duo karrigan and kioshima are really dead weight
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u/cRABFATHER FaZe Jul 17 '17
IMO rain is been stepping up far more than any of his teammates in the recent matches, including Niko.
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u/stewieeeeeeeee FaZe Jul 17 '17
rain, rain, NiKo, allu playing 4v5 against mouz smh
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u/Blackyy FaZe Jul 17 '17
At this point I am almost fine with Rain pulling a Raymond Bourque and winning a Major with another team. Give the guy a goddamn break. Following this team is hard.
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Jul 17 '17
This has been for quite a long time, he has been carrying faze for quite a time now, it must feel shit to be him, rest should start stepping up. He literally solo holds bombsites and the games are like pugs to him almost
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u/manatidederp NiP Jul 17 '17
Or the casual quad entries... Or routinely getting 5+ kills over the two pistol rounds etc.
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u/DesHis 5 years coin Jul 17 '17 edited Jun 19 '25
quiet tie dinner square long sharp unwritten scale direction teeny
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u/Element_108 Jul 17 '17
Im a big fan of kio, but lately his performance has been very bad... Hope he gets in the right track again
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u/Keeemy ENCE Jul 17 '17 edited Jul 17 '17
We in the dumpster now boys.
Kio and Karrigan losing duels left and right. Also, not impressed by Karrigan's strats.
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Jul 17 '17
Damn I wish Karrigan was more of a Gla1ve and less of a Pronax
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u/VG-enigmaticsoul G2 Jul 17 '17
Hey at least you guys didn't flip a coin to pick maps. Almost had a aneurysm watching g2 - navi
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u/IFlipCoins Jul 17 '17
I flipped a coin for you, /u/VG-enigmaticsoul The result was: heads
Don't want me replying on your comments again? Respond to this comment with 'leave me alone'
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Jul 17 '17 edited Jul 17 '17
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u/A_Sad_Goblin MOUZ Jul 17 '17
What does the ropz meme mean ?
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u/sluttymcbuttsex Astralis Jul 17 '17
People really like Ropz and want to see him reach his potential
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u/RadiantSun FaZe Jul 17 '17
Love the second one, he's such a good player and seems like a nice, humble kid too. Plus he is really carrying his weight and doing dirty work in Mouz, and still playing well.
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u/Le_Tennant MOUZ Jul 17 '17
I remember when Spiidi was playing solo B and he would die without getting a kill most of the time
Ropz almost always got 2+ kills
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u/Apisit100 Jul 17 '17
RIP pick ems
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u/Cravot Jul 17 '17
I had them 3-0, so it doesn't really matter for my pickems if they bomb out
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u/Canzler G2 Jul 17 '17 edited Jul 17 '17
karrigan: "Mouz used the well-known bug of pressing mouse1 to shoot, I thought we made a gentleman agreement not to use it."
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u/Mocresto FaZe Jul 17 '17
FaZe is one of favorites
Kio with 18 kills in 58 rounds so far...
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u/hulksreddit 10 years coin Jul 17 '17
FaZe with their backs to the wall from day 2, who would've thought
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u/Scar20Grotto Jul 17 '17
Niko was the problem
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u/PootieTooGood BIG Jul 17 '17
and with their powers combined, Niko and Kioshima became a whole new problem, together
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u/gatrcs Jul 17 '17
So yeah, mousesports is better without niko.
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u/stenerikkasvo Jul 17 '17
teamwork >
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u/Slumph Jul 17 '17
Teamwork makes the dreEeEeEeam work. Especially if you have some confidence and not a cucked mentality that you have to drop to daddy niko and if you fuck up then daddy niko's gonna be mad and get the belt :(
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u/gregfromjersey 5 years coin Jul 17 '17
Or maybe ropz and oskar are gods, you know... the two players NiKo never got to play with. How many maps NiKo and Oskar played together? LUL
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u/chair549 Jul 17 '17
YES MOUZ!!!!!
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u/EmhyrvarSpice FaZe Jul 17 '17
I still stand by what I said after the semi vs SK.
-Kio -Karrigan -Allu -NiKo
+Rain +Rain +Rain +Rain
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Jul 17 '17 edited Jul 17 '17
First half
After winning the pistol Faze had a fairly standard setup with rain close to popdog and Niko and Karrigan further back by ivy/A site. You had 2 players on B with Kio playing the advanced position by the ramp and Allu by the back of the site hoping to get an AWP later; until Allu had the awp though he played forwards too sometimes.
Oskar and one other player would usually go ivy and take an aggressive fight to put pressure on Karrigan and Niko while ChrisJ would push up A main quite far to try and "lurk" around the fights taking place in ivy, so for example if Karrigan/Niko fall back after a smoke they could fall into ChrisJ if they fall into the site, for example. This worked well since Oskar would almost always win the first fight vs Karrigan (Niko played further back since he may also have to help Rain so can't refrag) then the other player with Oskar baits Niko out and Oskar gets the double, then the ivy player(s) and Chris can push out together and kill Rain on two fronts and they've got the site! As on inferno, Oskar is absolutely THE KEY PLAYER for Mousesports from a tactical as well as a firepower perspective.
Allu moves onto A after Faze lose two buy rounds on it and Kio is alone at the start of the round in an aggressive B position with Rain/Allu playing the flexible position in between the sites.
Obviously, Oskar didn't ALWAYS go to ivy and sometimes Mousesports would just rush A with a site smoke and a smoke in between the trains so they could hide in it to push up into the ivy players and to get around the offensive defender in rain. This did, however, leave ivy open so Niko/Karrigan (usually Niko) could push up ivy and flank Mousesports, although such a flank takes a while and the bomb is usually already planted and ticking by the time Niko gets around to A main.
At around 5-3 To Mousesports they also started to go B. Faze rarely had the economy to give Allu the awp (Niko was using it a lot and was getting outdueled by Oskar) so Mousesports just rushed out lower and overwhelmed Kio who was pretty much on his own then Allu would stay back to try and delay the plant but to no avail. Lowel was actually entrying which he doesn't usually do and actually winning a lot of his early fights.
Niko tried to push ivy I suppose to just try to get a nice individual flank of Mousesports fairly slow A setups but it didn't work often as Mouz would always have someone holding the ivy angle and it just made stretched out the A hold even more and usually drew Allu away from B, meaning Kio was alone on B.
On the first gun round (10-7 Mouz) Ropz played solo on B around the bomb train and on A site Denis played ivy with Oskar rotating from ivy/site with ChrisJ and Lowel holding passively on A site but not leaving the train area so they can still help ivy and making popdog control pretty pointless for the T side.
Faze would try to do a fairly spread out A take with 2 players sending out smokes for site/connecter and pushing through to take the early fights with train/site players then Niko attempting to push through ivy later while the ivy holders were distracted, then finally the popdog played be able to either push out there or rotate back to main depending on what the needs of the team are. This didn't really work though as Mouse played ivy-heavy so, there was always someone watching for Niko's (or Karrigan's) push on ivy and the Popdog player was made quite useless. There wouldn't be any early pushers from Mouse although Lowel would sometimes hold by the brown train so the two main players would often become isolated from the rest of their teammates so the whole execute would just fall apart.
Oskar moved to help Ropz at B because despite Ropz playing super well and getting a kill each push he played advanced so wouldn't really delay the push for that long which did give away a round or two not really because of Ropz-he has to play advanced or the plant will happen anyway-but just because playing solo B with a rifle is hard. With Oskar playing around upper Faze were forced to diversify their push in both lower and upper which made Ropz' hold not impossible, but still hard and Mous' B hold was entirely reliant on Ropz winning the opening duel, which he didn't always.
At 13-11 to Mousesports Faze changed their A take up a bit by sending Rain/Kio to take drop and push quite fast out of it while using a general awp/smoke execute out of A main. Because you can't see popdog when you're holding from the train this draws ChrisJ and Lowel out into the open and leaves one player alone in ivy. Niko and Karrigan would then push down ivy and take the fight to the lone ivy player who would now have no backup and get the kill on him even if Karrigan was sacrificed in the process. This was a smart move from Karrigan and not the obvious one, it requires a really good knowledge of how Mouz was holding A and he deserves some credit for organising the take. I would've just rushed B and got sprayed down by Ropzmeister, but that's why I'm not a pro player.
Ultimately what allowed Faze to come back was because of this tactical change from Karrigan as well as Ropz not ALWAYS being able to hold up his awesome form on the B site, which is quite understandable tbh since it's not like you can expect a player to get 2-3 kills every time he gets pushed by players like Niko and Rain, although he still deserves a lot of credit for an admirable attempt and he would get a lot of doubles and never let Faze get too healthy an economy even when they won a few rounds in a row. He had fewer kills than Lowel but had a higher impact in that sense.
After second half: 15-15, over time.
OVERTIME
As overtime started Faze kept the same A strategy but Mousesports countered this by having Lowel playing by e-box meaning that none of the ivy/train players were pulled out of position by rain's popdog aggression. ChrisJ also played closer to the site in case Lowel died as you can pretty much kill people from all 3 angles of attack from the site, then you still have 2 people by ivy/train and Ropz alone on B (with Oskar rotating around the place).
The issue with the Mouz B hold was that if Oskar lost the awp duel vs Allu/Niko (which to be he hadn't done so much but...) then 2 Faze players could rush out upper and loop around to sandwich Rain. Mousesports had quick rotates from A and Mouzesports had countered Faze again in a fascinating tactical contest between Karrigan and I presume ChrisJ. This game has been one of the most fun in the tournament for sure.
End of 1st half was 18-15 Mouz.
Faze had an aggressive A setup with Rain and Niko by the upper trains and Kio quickly rotating from B but it didn't work as Mousesports split from main and popdog and caught out the rotaters.
Final score: 19-15 to Mouz. Man of the Match: Lowel
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u/H4v0c_AuT FaZe Jul 17 '17
Thanks for the writeup, currently on a train and cannot watch, so really appreciate it!
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Jul 17 '17
I just want to say, keep doing what you're doing man, If you enjoy doing these post-match recaps, don't give a fuck what some redditors say who don't have anything better to do than to shit on other people's work because they never made anything valuable before. I love how you keep doing this! And as you can see man people here like it. Keep up the good work, man!
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u/Fghuy100 EG Jul 17 '17
FaZe down FeelsBadMan
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u/emul4tion Liquid Jul 17 '17 edited Dec 19 '24
file fanatical slim aloof cobweb bored sheet snobbish yoke price
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u/EpikWarlord Jul 17 '17
Who would have thought FaZe would be 0-2?
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u/chemo-GER Jul 17 '17
Would be very interesting to see how many picked faze to go 3-0 even
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u/Icecolt Jul 17 '17
I'm pretty sure about 95% picked between: Astralis,Faze or SK. Faze is already 0-2 and Astralis vs SK is coming up next.
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u/Antichraldo MOUZ Jul 17 '17
Great display from Mouz, good to see that everyone performed well, no one was exactly dragged behined or carried. With performances like that, they can go a long way.
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u/Psychaz valeria Jul 17 '17
Kio has to step up or he's gonna be looking for a new team after this tournament
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Jul 17 '17
Are we already at the point Karrigan was with TSM and Astralis? He's being so obvious, lurking uselessly on T side and giving his frag away for free. Towards the end of regulation, he called that fast outside play and it worked like charm -- proceeds to not call it in any of the remaining rounds. Like, WTF is this calling?
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u/olofmeyser MOUZ Jul 17 '17
I was scared if mouse went 0-2 here they'd lose 0-3, but now I believe a bit more.
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u/iSluff Jul 17 '17
Whoever draws faze in an elimination match is gonna be pissed
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u/damgaard97 Astralis Jul 17 '17
What the fuck happened to Kio lately?
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u/Bulletspong3 valeria Jul 17 '17
Must be some kind of voodoo ritual that transferred kio's skill to rain.
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u/Tirppa ENCE Jul 17 '17
After Cologne I was like "oh shit they might actually not make it to play offs".
Wasn't expecting them to go 0-3 :D
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u/DrLejos cs_militia Jul 17 '17 edited Jul 17 '17
I think this is the first ten flag match at a major. Pretty cool to see ^^
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u/pedrohnj Jul 17 '17
just imagine if mouz's first major playoffs in a long time is right after they lose NiKo. oh god, imagine if NiKo himself still can't make the playoffs...
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u/Nidhoeggr89 cs_italy Jul 17 '17
German CS > Niko
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u/Dvergis FaZe Jul 17 '17
denis being the only german player of the roster.
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u/Rambofight BIG Jul 17 '17
6 out of 6 german players have beaten NiKo. German CS > NiKo is very accurate.
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u/howdybear Virtus.pro Jul 17 '17
0-2, they have to win every game from now on to secure legend spot
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u/chemo-GER Jul 17 '17
Must feel bad for niko loosing to both his former teammates in big and mouz going 0-2
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u/nanabe4r MOUZ Jul 17 '17
Is this really mousesports? My pessimistic german part of my personallity expected them to throw this game :) Or maybe i am used to it as a mousesports fan. gg wp
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u/DannyKII MOUZ Jul 17 '17
Do you remember how you felt one week ago after they went 2-0 at Cologne?
Hold you optimism!
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u/__fuck_all_of_you__ BIG Jul 17 '17
Previous majors have conditioned me to never again expect anything from throwsports in groups. And yet, when the
Ithe world needed them to throw the most, theydissapearedwon. Rip pickems. Why does mouz allways have ruin it?→ More replies (1)
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u/httputub clutch Jul 17 '17
mouz was abusing their superior play the whole game, pls FaZe gentemen's agreement with the enemy to not be too good for the next match.
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u/MajestyA Jul 17 '17
Rain is, as always, phenomenal. But that was a mess by FaZe as a team, never mind as a world Top 3 team.
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u/wlalele1337 FaZe Jul 17 '17
36 ADR, now I see why he did not change his sticker :-).
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u/loveicetea Astralis Jul 17 '17
FaZe's kryptonite are german organisations (BIG, mouz). So that means Penta will knock them out lmao
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u/reflexmaster123 ENCE Jul 17 '17
chris j had a little smirk on his face when he shook hands with niko lmao
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Jul 17 '17
When they fucked up the second pistol round you knew they were in trouble. Losing several duels against low hp in such a crucial round is unacceptable at a major.
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Jul 17 '17
Starting to think Mouse made a deal with FaZe to only sell NiKo if they lose to them each time they play in an important match lol
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u/LarrcasM 500k Celebration Jul 17 '17
Sooner or later FaZe was bound to fall off. The biggest reason they're so good was is that they're just outaiming people.
As soon as people knew what to expect from them, there wasn't a doubt in my mind that FaZe was going to slowly go downhill, but this is quite the drop off.
Maybe when NiKo realizes he has a chance to actually win a major he starts feeling the pressure, where in Mouz he knew he never had a chance...
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u/Rooksone Liquid Jul 17 '17
FaZe fans really are obnoxious. Team loosing two group stage games after months of finals and semis. Everyone is loosing their shit...
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u/Yemaka Astralis Jul 17 '17
So acording to you its obnoxious to see a Championship contender team loss to teams they on paper are far above and be abit pissy about it ?
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u/xChuChainz Jul 17 '17
Kio so predictable in every situation. He can't adapt and reposition at all.
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u/RezzaCS Natus Vincere Jul 17 '17
/u/XalYWero Looks like Faze were anti-stratted again :>
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Jul 17 '17
Can't win if you are basically playing 3v5 ¯_(ツ)_/¯
Kio and Karrigan really need to step up. Might be too late now thought.
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Jul 17 '17
I didn't pick faze, thought they were a bit overrated , thank God I didn't pick them to 3-0. SK or G2 Imo.
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u/n1ckst4r02 400k Celebration Jul 17 '17
Embarassment of a team... going 0/2 losing to 2 teams they are heavily favored vs and on their good maps too.
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u/Ravioli227 BIG Jul 17 '17
Faze and losing to "German" teams. Name a more iconic duo.
Better hope they don't get Penta next round. ;)
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u/Ravioli227 BIG Jul 17 '17
In actuality, it wouldn't surprise me at all if faze went 3-2 and still made it out of group stage.
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u/thekmanpwnudwn 500k Celebration Jul 17 '17
I'm more confident that Faze will comeback from 0-2 than mouz would have come back from 0-2
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u/KronoS275 Jul 17 '17
karrigan: We have agreed on a gentleman agreement between mouz and us, not to use any tactics.